# Those little anti-Halloween pamphlets...



## Antimars (Jan 6, 2010)

Bah. Pretty sure this has been discussed before but _honestly_, what is up with some people?

So my younger cousin randomly showed me something she obtained from last year's TOTing -- a little pamplet. It was inoccuous enough, a small, miniaturised comic book. 'Twas labeled, "The Devil's Night", was coloured in attractive black and orange, and had a picture of two TOTs overshadowed by some sort of devil figure. 

Cool! I thought. And happily began to read it.

The lead character's name was Buffy -- which automatically brought to mind Whedon's fabulous series (what can I say, fond teenaged memories), but then...something was not quite right. The art was...all wrong. The story...did not make sense. This girl kept on ranting on how much she HATED Halloween...and how evil her mother and teacher were (very craftily drawn to practically waft evilness btw) for making them all dress up for Halloween. Blahblahblah by the time I realised what it was, I couldn't put it down. I mean, I've known these things existed but have never actually...seen one in real life before, you know?

So it goes on explaining how Halloween is Satan's night, and how it originated with Pagan priests stealing children away to sacrifice them if the peasant families couldn't give them any food (wtf?), how it is the devil's way of coercing children into sinful ways...you know the drill. How the priests would leave "faces drawn on pumpkin like things" (what?) to signify the houses they'd visited...gah. I can't even remember half of it but it was the typical "Halloween is a Satanist holiday" bs. Then of course it started spouting Christianity and how you were going to go to hell if you didn't believe this and do that and pray for this...

I have little problem with Christianity, but if this were my kid I'd roundhouse kick the door down of whoever idiot had dropped this into their treat bag and perhaps none too politely demand that they obstain from trying to *force their religion on some other person's child*. Seriously. Then it would take every ounce of my control to not urinate in their fog machine on the way out.

Sorry...I just find this so *darned* rude.


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## Guest (May 4, 2010)

Yep, you're right- it has been discussed. But, thanx for sharing.


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## Otaku (Sep 10, 2004)

Agreed, those Jack Chick tracts are pretty weird. The Devil's birthday, indeed!


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## the dogman (Jul 8, 2007)

I wouldn't bother with telling the person off. I'd just take the pamphlet out of the treat bag and throw it away. I would also keep in mind where that house is and stay away from it year after year.
If anyone asked why I refused to take kids there, I would explain that I don't agree with their handouts and I would rather not waste my time. 

We have had an anti- Halloween group in town for many years now. They once tried to protest outside our house, but gave up when they saw they were attracting even more people to our haunt. Now they hold an indoor party and candy giveaway across town. Kids go there for treats and then come to our haunt for the scares.

Brushing it off and ignoring it is about the best route. It's a heck of a lot better than getting into an argument and possible lawsuit.


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## Dark Star (Sep 24, 2007)

We have not only had that, but people sticking brochures in the kids bags advertising their personal business and business that have nothing to do with Halloween or kids for that matter. 

Frustrating.


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## Biggie (Jul 29, 2009)

I am aiming to get some kind of anti-halloween stuff going on towards me, I like trolling people to much. I have already over heard my next door neighbors tell there kid to stay away from me, since I have all the satanic stuff in my garage.(It was a cow skull with pentagram on it) If I ever get to have a pro-haunt it will be more over the top than the house of shock, I really just want to freak people out. Maybe its from listening to too much punk music, and being a "rebellious teenager"


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## TK421 (Mar 27, 2009)

I have never seen one of those, but I'm very curious. Is there a PRO Halloween pamphlet out there? If not, I should take the time to draw one up in a similar style.


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## TK421 (Mar 27, 2009)

Dark Star said:


> We have not only had that, but people sticking brochures in the kids bags advertising their personal business and business that have nothing to do with Halloween or kids for that matter.
> 
> Frustrating.


*That's really low!*


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## Sidnami (Apr 26, 2010)

I say we make a anti-anti-Halloween pamphlet and offer a free drink with it just to add insult to injury. Who's with me on this?


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## TK421 (Mar 27, 2009)

Sidnami said:


> I say we make a anti-anti-Halloween pamphlet and offer a free drink with it just to add insult to injury. Who's with me on this?


*I completely support that!!*


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## osenator (Nov 3, 2009)

In my old neighborhoodm some freaks put a lifesize Darth Maul on a cross with a sign "Halloween is the Devil's holiday!" and some bible passage. Everyone was confused... Darth Maul from StarWar episode 1...Okay....I see the connection somewhere... no I don't... Let kids be kids... all they should care is Candy Candy Candy!!!!


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## Spats (Sep 21, 2006)

Lots of people collect Jack Chick Christian comics - they are considered by many to be the ultimate in comedic propaganda. They have little effect in recruitment. Even many hardcore evangelical christians find them disgusting and prone to outright falsehood.

The Internet has undermined and damaged many urban legends that would have been accepted without question decades ago (A Celtic Death God called Samhain, ancient Druids using pumpkins centuries before they were discovered in America, mass sacrifice of children).
These days, only the most isolated and xenophobic individual still considers these things legit.

Rejoice, my fellow ghouls, that you don't live in the '80s when the Great Satanic Panic swept the country. It was stated as fact in the media and in local government proceedings that an international satanic cult had control over the entire nation, and had murderous members in almost every school board, law enforcement unit and judicial body. They controlled all music, drug traffic, the sex industry and the news media. They had infiltrated the Boy Scouts, the Girl Scouts, the Freemasons and the Rotary Clubs, all churches, social groups, charities and even the FBI, the CIA and the Pentagon.

People blindly accepted stories of back-masking, kids taught to worship the devil via role-playing games, video games, comics and movies.
The topics of the day? Demonic possession,
breeding children solely for sacrifice,
camps where government officials summoned dark powers and butchered hundreds,
schools that were corrupting children
and even computer programmers working to make the Mark of the Beast possible - that stuff was common.
You heard it on the radio, talk shows, bookstores sold millions of titles on the subject, policemen were lectured on "satanic" crimes and anti-satan networks sprang up in churches all over the country to deal with the millions of cult survivors who may need shelter, protection and therapy.

Problem is, it was all bogus.

The country finally woke up and realized it was all jibberish. A few still cling to these discounted fears and legends because they never heard any different. Some use them as recruiting tools, trying to scare people into conversion. Some are, frankly, unhinged and delusional people who truly think they are raising the alarm for your benefit.

Most people these days? They laugh it off.
The curious look online, hit wikipedia and realize it's just another creepy but unfounded "have you checked the children?" story.
And there is nothing more devastating to propaganda than ridicule.

And the crucified Darth Maul? As an ex-evangelical, it makes perfect sense. A couple completely removed from current 'sinful' society saw the mask and, unaware of the Star Wars franchise (yes, there are people who are that cut off from current events) decided it was the most effective devil face for their project and they used it.


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## kjbittick (Oct 22, 2009)

As a christian, I have no problem with Halloween. I love all the scary, gory stuff. I don't see it as a satanic holiday, I just see it as a good time. If they want to get all bible-thumping on us, maybe they should work on making Christmas back into a christian holiday! All holidays have been so commercialized, they hardly bear any resemblance to the original holiday. I see no harm in celebrating Halloween as the fun holiday it had become. But I would agree on just avoiding those people's houses anyway. Besides, isn't kinda hypocritical to lure kids to your house by participating in the holiday to pass out propaganda about a holiday you don't believe people should be celebrating?


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## halloween71 (Apr 22, 2007)

Some people want to suck the life out of everything.If you don't like hween than why are you even opening the door to tot's.


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## Spats (Sep 21, 2006)

Halloween71,

think about it - if you honestly thought that children and teens were in danger of eternal hellfire, I mean really considered it a fact, would you just stay inside or would you hit the streets, trying to warn as many people as possible?

If I knew for a fact that every child that came to my door was going to be fed into a meat grinder feet first, I'd meet them at the sidewalk and drive them off with a firehose and a cattleprod.

Well, for this extreme minority, the threat of Halloween is just as dangerous. Better to pity them than despise them.
Despite our love of graveyards and ghouls, skulls and scares, blood and boogiemen and beasts, these folks have a much more horrifying world view.


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## LawP (Dec 4, 2007)

Spats, I always appreciate your insightful, lucid and on-point responses. One comment though...you left out politicians....I think true evil resides in many politicians...especially the ones I work for. 

Unfortunately, many evil things have been and still are done in the name of religion This is relatively benign but still bothersome when you consider these people purposely lure the children to their door. You have to feel sorry for someone who practices a religion that mandates you suck every last ounce of happiness out of your life on earth so you can be rewarded with real estate in the clouds.


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## savagehaunter (Aug 22, 2009)

I am Christian. I believe Halloween is a great celebration and a time to fun. Those wack-jobs handing out that crap to kids are deranged lunitics. I would be too tempted to urinate on the doorstep of those people. It is not aganst the law to believe in a religiouse view in our country. But it is morally corupt to try to convert people on my favorite night of the year. Let kids be kids. Those morons trying to ram their views down TOTS thoughts are wrong.


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## wolfang (Aug 25, 2009)

I am Christian as well, Halloween is my favorite holiday and I am very familiar with these comical tracts. I also find everything wrong with the "facts" that these tracts contain when referring to Halloween. I'm a bit of a history buff as well and after doing an extensive research report on the origins of Halloween for school, I find it insulting that they would even play on the idea that children were sacrificed on Samhain night. According to my research, there are documentations that animals were sacrificed, but there is no solid evidence that human sacrifices ever occurred.

Halloween is a fun time of year for me and I do love to decorate my yard with all sorts of spooky things like tombstones, ghosts and pumpkins and such, but never do I think that I'm worshiping evil. Rubbish!


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## HalloweenDan (Sep 6, 2007)

The neighbors across the street from us once had christian music playing and a banner on their garage with a bible verse on it. They had spot lights on it and the music playing all night.


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## Yubney (Sep 14, 2009)

Biggie said:


> I am aiming to get some kind of anti-halloween stuff going on towards me, I like trolling people to much. I have already over heard my next door neighbors tell there kid to stay away from me, since I have all the satanic stuff in my garage.(It was a cow skull with pentagram on it) If I ever get to have a pro-haunt it will be more over the top than the house of shock, I really just want to freak people out. Maybe its from listening to too much punk music, and being a "rebellious teenager"


You want a pentagram check out my older album... it gets displayed in my bay window. LOL

But yeah those little booklets me and my friends used to ahem... party and laugh at them they are so rediculously infantile in their attempt at "programming". I think Al Qaida models their indoctorines on them.


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## Ramiel (Sep 21, 2009)

If someone can come up with a good short story for the anti-anti-Halloween phamplet let me know, I can do the artwork (it's my job afterall)


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## hallorenescene (Dec 28, 2007)

my first haunt was kiddie corner from a church. it was great, after the kids went for awhile to the anti halloween party the church put on, the kids would hit my haunt. i got more kids in my haunt in that location than any other location i have had. 
when i first started ebaying, i would check out the halloween site. someone use to put an anti halloween program on there for cheap. i use to keep an eye on it to see if it ever had any takers. none. one time just before it's time was up i clicked on to see if there was even any lookers, none. whoops, i probably gave them encouragement, hey we got a looker. lol. well, the way i see it, they spent money every time they posted it. 
some pretty sad things have been done in history in the name of christianity and religion, i don't make religious claims, i just claim i believe and give my faith in God.


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## Baldzillabill (Sep 25, 2009)

TK421 said:


> *That's really low!*


Agreed!! Looks like bad business to me. Very unprofessional. I'm all for advertising but not in a kid's TOT bag.


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## wolfang (Aug 25, 2009)

Yubney said:


> You want a pentagram check out my older album... it gets displayed in my bay window. LOL
> 
> But yeah those little booklets me and my friends used to ahem... party and laugh at them they are so rediculously infantile in their attempt at "programming". I think Al Qaida models their indoctorines on them.


Just saw your pentagram... and it is AWESOME~!


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## MotelSixx (Apr 14, 2010)

I put a bumper sticker on my truck that said 'What Would Satan Do?'. Good times!


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## Veckah (Apr 5, 2010)

MotelSixx said:


> I put a bumper sticker on my truck that said 'What Would Satan Do?'. Good times!


*LMAO* I love that sticker!

I must refrain from fully commenting on this thread for fear of unintentionally offending someone, I will just make this statement.

As someone who has been used as an example of how NOT to be at my town's Baptist church pulpit (along side my 15yr old daughter, by name I might add), and who is not a follower of the Christian faith, yet is the 'kool-aid mom' at another local christian church, I find these tracts offensive in the least, and down right combative at the most. At least offer real facts.


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## Haunter (Oct 12, 2005)

I hadn't come across these tracts in my child's TOT bag yet, so I had to look these up.
Here's a good one. See if you can contain your laughter.
http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/0032/0032_01.asp












> If someone can come up with a good short story for the anti-anti-Halloween phamplet let me know, I can do the artwork (it's my job afterall)


Great idea. It would have to be something outlining the history of the holiday (Samhain), the modern evolution of the holiday (jack o'lanterns, candy and costumes), and its purpose (to have fun!!).


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## the dogman (Jul 8, 2007)

I've had someone give me one of these in a hospital waiting room. I was there because my younger brother had broken his arm, and a guy handed me the little tract. It wasn't about Halloween, just general life things, but a part I remember was very anti Homosexuality. 

It made me giggle, I showed it to a few friends who got a laugh out of it too. I eventually tossed it out. 

I have nothing against religion, but seeing the goofy things people do to try and manipulate others into following their beliefs bothers me. I avoid people that blatantly try to convert me or others. 
Another thing that bugs me is being told that because I don't celebrate something a certain way, I must not be a true believer and therefore I am condemnable. But that is a different topic.


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## hallorenescene (Dec 28, 2007)

dogman, my daughter use to work for this lady who had been a huge halloween freak with her first husband. with her second husband she was a huge holier than thou freak. one day she was preaching to my daughter about some religous lunacy, and my daughter looked at her and said, but what if you have me worship the wrong god and i go to hell for it. she said you should have seen the look on the ladies face. well, the lady is again divorced and who knows what her belief is now. what ever her husband is i guess. lol. growing up my mom told me any time someone is overly religeous, never believe a word they say. she said they are the biggest liars and the biggest sinners. i am 58 now, and that wisdom has never failed me.


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## LawP (Dec 4, 2007)

Hallorenescene: It's like having a battle of wits with an unarmed person. That poor lady probably doesn't have an original thought. Kudos to your smart daughter.  That cracked me up.


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## trickortreat (Apr 15, 2008)

kjbittick said:


> Besides, isn't kinda hypocritical to lure kids to your house by participating in the holiday to pass out propaganda about a holiday you don't believe people should be celebrating?


HA! I bet they participate because they secretly enjoy seeing the costumes.


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## MacEricG (May 26, 2009)

*Halloween Repent Comics*

Hey Gang: While perusing the web I came across a boatload of these mini comics. Check it out —
http://www.breadonthewaters.com/0035_halloween_exposed.html

BTW: Christian here, too, and Catholic school survivor. Sometimes fanatics don't realize how much damage they do to their own cause. I'm reminded of the priest in The Exorcist that tries to warn Damien's father of danger by repeatedly chanting, "Eat the blood of Christ; Drink His blood."


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## hallorenescene (Dec 28, 2007)

but mac, it is true, the goblins will get you, they should know, for.....THEY ARE THE GOBLINS. quick, throw it back in their faces and run like h--- is after you. hahaha [i wonder what they would think if you did throw it back at them and run away loudly praying to be saved, you've heard of satanists like them] lol


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## the dogman (Jul 8, 2007)

MacEricG said:


> Hey Gang: While perusing the web I came across a boatload of these mini comics. Check it out —
> http://www.breadonthewaters.com/0035_halloween_exposed.html
> 
> BTW: Christian here, too, and Catholic school survivor. Sometimes fanatics don't realize how much damage they do to their own cause. I'm reminded of the priest in The Exorcist that tries to warn Damien's father of danger by repeatedly chanting, "Eat the blood of Christ; Drink His blood."


Read through these. They have some basic stories from the Bible but the stuff about Pagans is quite misconstrued.
This panel on the right bothers me as well. The attack on Pagans seems to have other possible intentions.


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## Terra (Sep 23, 2007)

Let's be careful. As a Christian, I feel my faith is being bashed  There are a few groups that do things in the name of Christianity but the vast majority of Christians love Halloween. 

Would we be posting the same _'snarks' _about another religion? There are fanatics in all religions and all non-religious groups of people. Hey, remember that Christians have feelings too... 



Quick fact:

_*The commandment:*_ _You shall not misuse the name of the Lord your God _

People who use the name of God to mislead people about his Word, is breaking this commandment and it is a sin.


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## the dogman (Jul 8, 2007)

Terra, I don't think anyone in this thread means to bash Christians as a whole, just the specific people or clusters of people that choose to use any means necessary to force their specific beliefs onto others. 

A majority of Christians, I believe, would laugh at these tracts and their tactics, but there are a few that wholeheartedly believe in them and believe that they must distribute them to vulnerable children.

I believe that preying upon children is wrong. You can scare a child into a lot more than you can scare an adult into. It is unfair to the child to warp them into one set of beliefs before they have a chance to explore other ideas. 

It is also unfair to distribute propaganda that vilifies other people for simply enjoying a holiday and demonizing the roots of the holiday. Misinformation can bring down a holiday quickly if large numbers of people believe it.


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## wolfang (Aug 25, 2009)

the dogman said:


> Read through these. They have some basic stories from the Bible but the stuff about Pagans is quite misconstrued.
> This panel on the right bothers me as well. The attack on Pagans seems to have other possible intentions.


It's funny you posted this image because I'll admit I actually own 3 of these tracts (this being one of them) only because my love for Halloween made me keep them, but I do think that they are way over the top. When trying to get a message across to the point of twisting historical facts to do so, I have a big problem with this.

I am a Christian as well and I do have my solid beliefs, but I do catch myself laughing at the poorly executed "tract-facts" as well. I like the artwork in 'em tho~!

Got a link to these comics too:
http://www.chick.com/catalog/tractlist.asp


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## jackpot (Nov 1, 2008)

Yeah gotta love Jack Chick, or not. He's been up on his soapbox for to long now with his little pamphlets. It's not just Halloween he's after or Wicca, he's an equal opportunity bigot he even has hate literature against other Christians and even as far as Bhuddsts, and a few charity organization's. Gays and lesbians get some hate tossed their way. Pretty much every single group that doesn't believe exactly as he does.

Lets just say there's a reason he's never seen in public and has made sure no one knows where he lives. He's basically pissed off everyone that doesn't agree with him. He's made a fortune spreading the hate for about 40 years now.


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## liuoliveira (Oct 2, 2008)

hooo boy ..................................................................


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## Spats (Sep 21, 2006)

Terra said:


> Let's be careful. As a Christian, I feel my faith is being bashed  There are a few groups that do things in the name of Christianity but the vast majority of Christians love Halloween.
> 
> Would we be posting the same _'snarks' _about another religion? There are fanatics in all religions and all non-religious groups of people. Hey, remember that Christians have feelings too...


Honestly, this thread isn't dealing with Christianity, it is dealing with fanaticism. Now in the Western world, the vast majority of attacks on Halloween come from fanatics who consider themselves Christian, but the ideas and philosophies of the Christian faith are NOT seen as the issue, Terra, only those who use it as a weapon on others.

I wouldn't want you to think that everyone who lives by the teachings of Christ are seen as the problem - they aren't.

The majority faith of the United States is Protestant Christianity.
The majority of the United States celebrates Halloween with happiness.
Obviously, Christianity isn't the problem.

And if another branch of fanatical believers were attacking Halloween with as much misinformation and media saturation as folks like Jack Chick, yes - they would be spotlighted and criticized as well.

Frankly, I'd rather those who consider themselves christians lead the effort to expose people like Jack Chick.


EDIT- I'd like to point out that we wouldn't have All Hallows Eve if it hadn't been preserved by the early Church, and the idea that we should live without fear... ( http://www.halloweenforum.com/general-halloween/89785-need-halloween.html) ... is a very biblical concept.


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## Terra (Sep 23, 2007)

Thank you Spats, very well said. I see these threads crop up bi-annually and it saddens me that the distinction isn't made more commonly. In many past responses I see _'Christians are this'_ and _'Christians do that_'. Thus my post. I feel I must speak up and make the distinction that because some people use God's name in vain _(speak for Him)_ and call themselves Christians does not mean they speak for God nor for my beliefs.


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## jackpot (Nov 1, 2008)

Spats said:


> Frankly, I'd rather those who consider themselves christians lead the effort to expose people like Jack Chick.


I'd like this focus on this part right her because it highlights the issue very well that I'm about to make. People like Jack Chick are in the minority people who believe as he does and spread hate as he does are in the minority when it comes to Christians. Here's the problem they are active in spouting their crap so active in fact that it's all you hear because the others don't speak up and when they do they get drowned out. The minority in this situation is 100 times louder than everyone else so they are the ones most often heard and perceived. 

If the other Christians would stand up against people like him, such as the churches standing up against a new fringe group called Repent Amarillo that's sprouted up a couple hours from where I live, then they could be as equally drowned out and un-listened too. The best way to counter Jack Chick's propaganda, and other people and groups like him, is through open communication and education. We can complain about it all we want on here but until it's talked about and communicated in a calm, educated, and complete way it's never gonna do any good. Even then it may not do any good for some people will only ever believe what they want to reguardless of the facts.


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## Terra (Sep 23, 2007)

jackpot said:


> If the other Christians would stand up against people like him, such as the churches standing up against a new fringe group called Repent Amarillo that's sprouted up a couple hours from where I live, then they could be as equally drowned out and un-listened too.


How do you recommend a church do that? There are fringe groups and individuals that crop up all the time.

I believe that Christians bring others to our faith by leading a life that is respectful and admiring. Calling out and being confrontational wouldn't be the way I would choose. Now, that path does have it's limitations_._ For example, in what you just said. People masquerade as Christians all the time and take advantage of the humbleness of Christians. But, of the two options, I feel that leading a Christian life that others can witness and decide for themselves is the best way. It is the _Christian_ way. 

Consider this: I believe in the existence of the devil. One of his most effective tools to make people doubt Christianity or shake Christians of their faith is to have others say and do things in the name of that faith _(wolf in sheep's clothing)._ I would go as far as to say it's his go-to weapon.

I just wish more people would be more skeptical of a person who does something so unlike how most Christians behave.


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## Spats (Sep 21, 2006)

Jackpot, while agree with most of your comments, the one issue I have is this...

"We can complain about it all we want on here but until it's talked about and communicated in a calm, educated, and complete way it's never gonna do any good."

I disagree with that.

Yes, some folks can be a little harsh here when it comes to perceived attacks on Halloween from certain fringe groups, and the statements made can seem a little broad-brush.
But Halloweenforum.com is one of the main online communities and resources for all things Halloween.
Having this issue discussed here, one of the most popular internet locales for the holiday, does do some good.
Anyone looking into Halloween online will likely find this forum in short order, and concerns about what the holiday means from a theological stance will lead to threads just like this one.

I think we do some good discussing it here, as long as we make it clear who we are talking about, i.e., zealots like Jack Chick, aggressive school boards, so called "family" organizations and other loud minorities who don't represent the vast majority of believers of any faith.


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## Antimars (Jan 6, 2010)

Very interesting points made in a lot of posts.

I know I came across as more than a little bit p*ssy, so I apologise if my statements may have come across as "broad-brush". I know he is not considered a model Christian citizen and one of those zealot types who are always the sort to do things like this, but it is irking nonetheless...and ranting about it here is as good a place as any. Just last year all the houses in this neighborhood had very harsh anti-Halloween fliers hung around the doorknobs one night.

That rubbed me the wrong way as well. I have not yet figured out how to "turn the other cheek", shall we say. Perhaps the idealist in me would just wish that a certain small minority who are so outwardly vocal about their beliefs remain quiet.  Yes, yes, freedom of speech and all that. I have the freedom to grumble over my gullible young cousin accusing
me of Satanism because she caught me corpsing a skull the same day she handed me that silly little comic.

Quoted from "the dogman" -- *It is unfair to the child to warp them into one set of beliefs before they have a chance to explore other ideas. * My main beef with all of this.

I do hope no one miscontrued my original post to be bashing any sort of religion. My friend, a Christian and Halloween lover himself, shook his head at the comic as we were laughing over it at lunch. It is true that minorities can ruin the reputations of and all too often are stood as unjust representations of entire groups.


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## Brimstonewitch (Aug 23, 2009)

Hi everyone, 

I think there were a lot of great points all over the post regarding this topic. I personally think you can only judge the individual and not the belief. If you don't, it's the same as saying something like "all white people are lazy" or any other assumptions made daily about races. 

For example: one of my co-workers is very strong in her Christian beliefs and her parents have often criticized her for being friends with me (a Pagan). She was finally able to make her parents see how narrow minded they were being when her supervisor, who is also a very devout Christian follower, targeted her and got her fired simply because she didn't like her. The next time her parents said something about her being friends with a Pagan, she retorted back with "well the Christian who should be so good to me got me fired and the Pagan you dislike, without ever having met, is the one who got me another job and supported me the whole time". 

It's crazy how people automatically judge based off beliefs or appearances without ever really getting to know a person and sadly it follows many areas of life such as religion. I simply say take the time to say hi and get to know a person before I jump to conclusion.


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## kprimm (Apr 3, 2009)

If i ever get a pamplet like this i will just take it with me and use it for toilet paper when i go camping.


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## jackpot (Nov 1, 2008)

Terra said:


> How do you recommend a church do that? There are fringe groups and individuals that crop up all the time.


By speaking out without messages of sin and trying to convert anymore, simply by attempting to say anything else. When you have fringe groups spreading hate they get all the attention because they are louder but more often than not the people who truly are good people sit by and do nothing. Look at the news you get the bad and you get the scandalous and they always get more time then the good and hopeful stories. I'm not blaming the news people here and so very very much not trying to open any kind of discussion or argument of modern media. It's just simple fear sells and controversy sells, so they get more airtime, and all those groups are just that. It's a good experiment I've done in psych and business classes watch the news and time the amount of time dedicated to murder, rape, hate crimes, basically anything that just sucks in general and time the really happy stories and compare them. 

It the non zealous-ultra-nuts could get even half the air time I think it would do a world of good. In the case of the local situation the local churches to combat the negatives of Repent Amarillo when to the local news and every time Repent gets a stories the other churches get a rebuttal. Every time Repent sends a letter dozens more from calmer heads without rage in mind send in their own. Just even the simple act of saying hey we aren't all like that in a public setting helps. That's all I was trying to say.

As for Spats, I think I may have been misunderstood, mostly do to my not wording it properly. I didn't mean to imply, which i basically did, that talking about it here didn't do any good. I agree with you that it does, I was simply trying to make the point that more should be done to bring about greater affect. Forgive me I am flawed, and summer break just started so my brain has gone on a cruise.

Things I write may not come out completely accurate sometimes as I really should also proofread better. Ultimately I'm just glad this entire situation from the get go didn't degrade into situation of nu huh and ya huh mixed with people actively attacking each other as happens on so many forums. That may be one of the reasons I like this place so much I can tread and speak without fear of trolls and flame wars starting up.


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## Spats (Sep 21, 2006)

Nah, Jackpot, it's all good.

Point taken and understood.


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## discobandit (May 6, 2010)

Gosh, sorry if this has been covered already but I see people starting to debate on a forum, and my eyes just glaze over as I scroll past it 

Wouldn't the best thing to do (not only to combat these, but for the holiday in general) be to raise awareness to dispel the common myths and build curiosity around the origins?

Heck, a business-card sized shot of orange paper, black ink, with a stereotypical haunted house + one paragraph from wikipedia in the treat bags you hand out would do wonders. A little orange card with candy attached talking about how cool halloween is would immediately stick with a kid's memory, more than those terrible disjointed chick-tracts could possibly do. A simple, classy, and sassy approach would be wickedly effective and terribly easy to implement to anyone with the budget to buy a ream of pumpkin-orange paper for their printer.


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## Gym Whourlfeld (Jan 22, 2003)

*Seriously Flawed People*

Do upset most of we normal people especially when they scream down from their soap box that they are perfect and we should listen to, contribute to, and do as they (say) they do.
It does make me wonder though when groups of normal people turn towards these limping others and give them so much audience.
The dark historical moments from all major religions don't hold a candle to actual evil deeds of the individual(s) in history. Unfortunately absolute power corrupts, absolutely as seen throughout the history of man and what we like to call "civilization".
The yearning to inflict power over someone else is a sensation many of us cannot turn away from whether political, social, economic or religious.
"NA! NA! I'm smarter than you, I'm better than you! I get to tell you what to do!"
(Or You will suffer the consequences as determined by ME!)
I think most of us are basically , usually in question or rebellion against this attitutde when expressed by the obviously flawed and inept.
If it doesn't feel right (makes your skin crawl , rolls the stomach some) then it probably is not right.


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## Not-so-sunny-lane (Jan 31, 2009)

My father was a Baptist minister for over 45 years and he loved Halloween. My first "haunted house" was helping his youth group put one together for the Children's Halloween party over 25 years ago. He passed away last July (RIP) and I seriously doubt celebrating Halloween kept him from getting inside those pearly gates.


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## uncletor (Dec 6, 2007)

I'm lucky. As a MASON, I'm already branded as a TOOL OF SATAN by Jack Chick already. 

I've been reading those things for years. Never fail to make me laugh. There's a great great dvd out there with wild interviews of the artists and folks invovled...a dead pan masterpiece. Order now, and you can get a parody tract. 

It's called GOD'S CARTOONIST.

Our best year was when the neighbour had the Catholic chanting music with statues of Fighting Michael and christmas angels on the lawn. The snake that Fighting Michael is about to kill had his face about eye level for kids. My son is still freaked out by it. All I have to do is start singing;"Santos, santos, damien, damien" and he gives me the look...This guy handed out cards with St. Michael on one side and...toothpaste...you need clean teeth to get to The Promised Land I guess.

Last year I found out our new neighbours were Moonies. 
I found this out because they passed out leaflets about Rev. Moon and the Unification Church. It led to the best line of the night. 
The little kids were going by and one said to the other;"WHO is this MOON guy??" And the other replied:'Don't you know ANYTHING?? He invented the MOONPIE...big candy maker...this is an AD..." They both threw them over their shoulders at the same time.

Don't pee on the fog machine. (You might get a zap). They can talk. You don't have to listen. 

Besides, my fave is the one where Johnny FREAKED out by the SCARY HAUNTED HOUSE runs into the street and is greased by a car. His pals ask the Sunday school teacher if he went to heaven, and she assures them he's frying in hell because HE WAS NOT SAVED. HE WAITED TOO LONG. Meanwhile, Johnny??? He's in HELL and it looks JUST LIKE THE HAUNTED HOUSE!!! Ahhh!!! (Bet you didn't see THAT one coming!) I've been thinking about handing that thing out as a JOKE for years, but still haven't...too weird...


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## Junit (Sep 1, 2008)

I got one of those pamphlets once when I tot'd. And some other little books about America selling out to oil companies lol which looking back is horribly ironic... anyways...
They have a right to complain and think it's whatever they want to think. I don't know why they waste their time though. Halloween is definately not going anywhere. And it's rare to find it celebrated as a satanic holiday, Why ruin it for the kids?
TK - I like the pro-Halloween flyers idea.


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## uncletor (Dec 6, 2007)

yeah, that reminds me...the 2 best parody tracts that might give you ideas for your Pro Halloween tract are WHO WILL BE EATEN FIRST? and another one that exposes the mistakes in BIG DADDY Chicks tract on evolution.
No, I won't give you a link.
Lawyers for Chick have gutted a Jack Chick parody site, and the guys behind WHO WILL BE EATEN FIRST usually stay just one step ahead of the process server. but a bit of google and you should find them both...have fun.


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## Trinity1 (Sep 5, 2009)

hallorenescene said:


> dogman, my daughter use to work for this lady who had been a huge halloween freak with her first husband. with her second husband she was a huge holier than thou freak. one day she was preaching to my daughter about some religous lunacy, and my daughter looked at her and said, but what if you have me worship the wrong god and i go to hell for it. she said you should have seen the look on the ladies face. well, the lady is again divorced and who knows what her belief is now. what ever her husband is i guess. lol. growing up my mom told me any time someone is overly religeous, *never believe a word they say. she said they are the biggest liars and the biggest sinners. i am 58 now, and that wisdom has never failed me.*




Amen to that sista! I have some bible banging relatives in western Pa....Ugh! One Aunt wouldn't even hand out candy on Halloween, yet alone let her kids go out to trick or treat. They were the most judgemental, had the most to say about what everyone else was doing wrong kind of people. It just never made sense to me...they weren't actually behaving the way they were telling other people to behave. 

I can totally understand that not everyone is going to believe in the same things, or that there really is no right and wrong answer when it comes to religion. But if your going to talk the talk....walk the walk....


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## Trinity1 (Sep 5, 2009)

uncletor said:


> I'm lucky. As a MASON, I'm already branded as a TOOL OF SATAN by Jack Chick already.
> 
> I've been reading those things for years. Never fail to make me laugh. There's a great great dvd out there with wild interviews of the artists and folks invovled...a dead pan masterpiece. Order now, and you can get a parody tract.
> 
> ...


You're a MASON?!?!?! So............you know secrets? It's an on going joke I have with my husband. His Grandfather was a MASON and would have loved for my husband to become one as well. Unfortunatly his Grandfather passed before he could really start getting my husband into it. I always say it's such ashame because he could have known all of their "secrets" as pertrayed in Hollywood of course


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## uncletor (Dec 6, 2007)

Yeah, I'm a Mason...18th degree...you either go onto the Shriners or Blue Lodge for the degrees after the 3rd. I went Blue Lodge, it's a family tradition dating back to 1835. ..that's why in the Jack chick parody tract I wrote about there's a mother getting mad at a Shriner trying to give her son crutches and calling him a tool of Satan. 
In reality we fund hearing tests for infants, run blood donor clinics, and yes, give out crutches to kids...stuff like that...
And yes, animal rights folks, I have for YEARS told anyone who will listen to me from the Shrine that they should scrap their circus and get something closer to Cirque de Soleil, use people not animals...
Secrets? The only really big ones are the pass words and such...you get a supper after lodge, and if anybody was allowed to come in, I'd run out of Lime-aid pretty quick...you try to have enough sloppy joes to feed the lodge membership and not the whole town. 
Masons started in 1717, no matter what DA VINCI CODE tells you. We have as much to do with the Templars as you do...the idea was that the different religions weren't going to GO AWAY, so we had to figure out a system where guys could get together and encourage each other to be better citizens and people and perform civic works, no matter what they believe..politics or religion or anything that is going to bust things up aren't talked about in lodge. 
Folks who think THEY have an exclusive brand name on truth never liked the toleration aspect of it, so we were in hot water with the Catholics for a while, but that's blown over...
Best conspiracy theory I've heard in a while: Masons, and the Illuminatti and The Jews killed Michael Jackson because he was going to blow the whistle on The New World Order.
It's a mixed bag. On one hand, the conspiracy stuff is funny. 
But in Germany during Hitler we went to the political prisoners camps...maybe as many as 200,000 died if memory serves. 
Compared to that, the Jack Chick tracts are small potatoes. I took some in one night for the guys so they could know the lies that were being spread and the truth to counter them.

But the Halloween ones are down right amazing...they are SO hate filled and alarmist..I've never heard of anyone YET who went down on their knees and asked for God's forgiveness and went home in the middle of ToT after reading one. Halloween is still one of those holidays we do RIGHT.


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## hallorenescene (Dec 28, 2007)

my father was a very proud mason. they do wonderful things. my grandson is in demolay now. he loves it. last year he wanted to go to a baseball camp so bad, but my daughter couldn't afford it. then she found out about the demolay camp. it was within her budget and the grandson can't wait to go this summer. it was for a week. they stayed in cabins and roughed it. during the day they went to classes. they were in missouri so they learned about the state of missouri. they had classes on helping others, being respectful, hygiene, and how it takes everyone in families to help out. they had classes in archery, bb shooting, canoeing, horse back riding, swimming, rock climbing, and if they wanted they even got to bungee jump. they attended a dance and got to meet i believe the rainbow girls. they cooked, cleaned, and picked up after themselves. they go to a different state this year. now if you call this satanism, i'd say you're a pretty confused individual.


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## Terror Tom (Nov 3, 2008)

Yeah I have seen these things. They are pretty unbelievable. And advertisements for businesses in treat bags, that is very rude!!!!


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## the dogman (Jul 8, 2007)

So does anyone know which branch of Christianity Jack Chick is trying to support?
I read through the tracts on his site and saw a lot of Anti - Catholic, Muslim, Halloween, Evolution, Voo-Doo, Native American, and (kind of surprisingly) promotes love for the Jewish. 

I know the branches of Christianity are all over the place, but I haven't seen any particular one that he seems to be promoting. A lot of the messages sound very hardcore Evangelical Christian, but I can't really say if that is his particular group.


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## discobandit (May 6, 2010)

He hates on everyone, but he's probably protestant. I'm not even joking, I swear there was a book about a person going to hell because they saved themselves, but not everyone around them, which made them a sinner.

People like him would be the exact reason why Ghandi said "I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ."


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## Eyegore (Aug 23, 2008)

TK421 said:


> I have never seen one of those, but I'm very curious. Is there a PRO Halloween pamphlet out there? If not, I should take the time to draw one up in a similar style.


I'll gladly help in creating this! I can't believe the lies, slander, and untruths some people "think" about this holiday!


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## bradg896 (Apr 5, 2006)

Personally, I love Chick Tracts, funniest damn things I've ever seen! Really, they have about as much real social impact as a Tom and Jerry cartoon. Doesn't matter what holiday it is, someone is gonna do their level best to mess it up for the next person. Look at the beating Christmas has been taken for the last few years (surprised no ones gone after Easter with a vengeance, but I guess it isn't a high-profile enough target). Sadly, there's always going to be some whack job who feels his rights supersede yours no matter what.


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## DeathClutch (May 16, 2010)

Not cool in my book. Halloween is an ancient tradition, and even though everyone has the right to not celebrate it, the tradition should at least be respected. Definitely stay away from that spook house man.


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## hallorenescene (Dec 28, 2007)

God loves everyone, 
But probably prefers 'fruits of the spirit' over 'religious nuts!'


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