# Patron Saint Of Halloween



## mooney (Oct 19, 2007)

oooooh.... I am first! 

*go Jack Skellington go!*


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## Embalmer71 (Sep 25, 2007)

Jack Skellington, beh... He's cool, but the Patron Saint of Halloween?


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## Halloweiner (Oct 2, 2003)

Well When you think of saints you think of someone from long ago. So that's one of MANY reasons I voted E. A. Poe.


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## mooney (Oct 19, 2007)

Embalmer71 said:


> Jack Skellington, beh... He's cool, but the Patron Saint of Halloween?


Yes - because his very reason to exist IS for Halloween. I think that he captures all that is best about the day, incorperating the horror as well as the fun and wonder that Halloween has given to me. 

your milage may vary...

I think the other nominations were rather one dimensional (not a slam by any means - each was very important in thier own way).

~mina


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## bayork (Oct 27, 2003)

Count me in for Jack Skellingon!

Just a clarification...shouldn't this be a vote for the patron saint of HalloweenForum.com...? OTW, I think a huge argument could be made that Jack O'Lantern is already the patron saint of Halloween....


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## guitarist155 (Sep 25, 2007)

hmm im unsure, there would not't be any copyright problems with jack-o-lantern but idk


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## deadlypeanutboy (Oct 9, 2007)

I don't know........

Don't you think that the patron saint should be a real person? Even though I originally nominated a fictional character, I think the saint of Halloween should be someone who actually influenced the way we celebrate the holiday. I know everyone is on this Jack Skellington kick but he's just an animated character; I don't think he really adds anything to how _I_ celebrate Halloween. That why I think Edgar Allan Poe or Stephen King would make a better saint, someone who influenced the whole horror/Halloween scene.


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## Dr. Slickshill (Mar 15, 2005)

deadlypeanutboy said:


> I don't know........
> 
> Don't you think that the patron saint should be a real person?


I've been thinking the same thing, though Jack Skellington seems to be wwaaay out ahead.


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## Shadow Mistress (Oct 26, 2007)

Jack is running away with this! I have no problems with him, but if you want a real person, then perhaps Edgar Allan Poe would be a better choice. Jack Skellington (and through his creator, Tim Burton) personifies the holiday, but without Poe there would be no subtle horror.


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## DeadTed (Aug 12, 2007)

I need some clarification. Jack O'Lantern - is that a specific being or the 'general' jack o lanterns?


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## bayork (Oct 27, 2003)

Jack O'Lantern is a "mythical" person....

Legend of Jack at Wikipedia

Legend of Jack at pumpkinnook

Legend of Jack at Jack-o-Lantern.com


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## DeadTed (Aug 12, 2007)

Thanks for the info.


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## jlb307 (Oct 15, 2007)

DeadTed said:


> I need some clarification. Jack O'Lantern - is that a specific being or the 'general' jack o lanterns?


That would be the original Jack of the Lantern legend. I'll post some background.


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## jlb307 (Oct 15, 2007)

This came from the nomination thread. Credit to Embalmer71:

Call me old fashioned, but I nominate Jack O'Lantern. Honestly, it shouldn't be anyone else. Check this out...

An old Irish folk tale tells of Jack, a lazy yet shrewd farmer who uses a cross to trap the Devil. One story says that Jack tricked the Devil into climbing an apple tree, and once he was up there Jack quickly placed crosses around the trunk or carved a cross into the bark, so that the Devil couldn't get down. Another myth says that Jack put a key in the Devil's pocket while he was suspended upside-down;

Another myth says that Jack was getting chased by some villagers from whom he had stolen, when he met the Devil, who claimed it was time for him to die. However, the thief stalled his death by tempting the Devil with a chance to bedevil the church-going villagers chasing him. Jack told the Devil to turn into a coin with which he would pay for the stolen goods (the Devil could take on any shape he wanted); later, when the coin/Devil disappeared, the Christian villagers would fight over who had stolen it. The Devil agreed to this plan. He turned himself into a silver coin and jumped into Jack's wallet, only to find himself next to a cross Jack had also picked up in the village. Jack had closed the wallet tight, and the cross stripped the Devil of his powers; and so he was trapped. In both myths, Jack only lets the Devil go when he agrees never to take his soul. After a while the thief died, as all living things do. Of course, his life had been too sinful for Jack to go to heaven; however, the Devil had promised not to take his soul, and so he was barred from Hell as well. Jack now had nowhere to go. He asked how he would see where to go, as he had no light, and the Devil mockingly tossed him an ember that would never burn out from the flames of hell. Jack carved out one of his turnips (which was his favourite food), put the ember inside it, and began endlessly wandering the Earth for a resting place. He became known as "Jack of the Lantern", or Jack-o'-Lantern.

There is no other Patron Saint of Halloween. None.


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## DeadTed (Aug 12, 2007)

Thanks jlb,
I knew of the legend and read up again when bayork posted. I can't think of anyone else more fitting for Halloween than that. I see a lot of Jack Skellington, but he's just one character from a movie - and fairly recent in the grand scheme of life. But that legen has been around for a long time and has inspired the most, IMO, recognizable and traditional aspects of Halloween. 
There _are_ people out there that don't know who Jack Skellington is, but everyone knows what a jack o lantern is (I know, I know - they probably don't know the 'legend' of it).


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## bayork (Oct 27, 2003)

I know a vote can't be undone on the charts...but the conversation in this thread has convinced me....

jlb307 - When you do the final tally, subtract my original vote for Jack Skellington and give it to Jack O'Lantern instead.

(which mean at this moment...YOU'RE the tie-breaker!)


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## Embalmer71 (Sep 25, 2007)

Okay check this out, if you are still undecided. 


Jack o' Lantern
by Brent P. Newhall
Many mistakenly believe that Jack o' Lantern was a damned soul, doomed to wander listlessly forever, or that pumpkins carved into Jack o' Lanterns are supposed to hold souls. While the former is partially true, it casts a negative shadow on the true story of Jack o' Lantern, which goes something like this (with variation): 
There once was a farmer named Jack who was both very lazy and very quick-witted. Now one day, the Devil came to Jack to tempt him, but Jack tricked the Devil into climbing a tree. The Devil could not climb down, and asked Jack for help. "On one condition," Jack replied. "That you not allow me into hell." The Devil could not very well refuse, so he grudgingly agreed and Jack helped him down. As everything does, eventually Jack died. He went straight to hell, but the Devil kept his word, and would not let him in. Jack traveled to heaven, but he had been so bad during his life, they would not let him in heaven either. So Jack hollowed out one of his gourds (it was originally a turnip) and made a lantern out of it. Even now he wanders the face of the world, trying to find somewhere he can stay... 

*Jack is generally described as very tall and lanky, but not unlikable. He is also personified in a couple of works, among which: "The Halloween Tree" by Ray Bradbury, as Carapace Clavicle Moundshroud, and in Tim Burton's film "The Nightmare Before Christmas", as Jack Skellington*. *Jack o' Lantern is analogous to Jack o' the Shadows, or Death Itself. *
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I bolded that last bit myself. Any doubts now?


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## deadlypeanutboy (Oct 9, 2007)

Even if Jack Skellington _is_ a recent personificaiton of Jack o'Latern, I still must protest. He's just one character from one movie; a pretty goofy movie if you ask me. Now don't get me wrong, I like the film just fine, but I just don't think that Jack Skellington is representative enough to be named Patron Saint of all of Halloween. 

I still like the idea of a real person: someone who shaped the popular culture around the holiday (Poe, Price, King, etc.); but I also think that Jack o'Latern is a pretty cool choice as well. I can't think of anything more iconic that a brightly lit pumpkin face on Halloween night.


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## DeadTed (Aug 12, 2007)

I just don't think of Jack Skellington as the epitome of Halloween. In fact, I rarely think of him at all during Halloween. I can't believe how many people here love him so much.


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## CROGLINVAMPIRE (Sep 21, 2006)

*Saintly effects*

I have to agree that it SHOULD be a living or formerly living person who has influenced Halloween...I love Poe, no argument there, but how can we ignore Mr Price!? How many of us were so more heavily influenced by all those Poe movies...Thriller (especially the laugh) the list goes on....Vinnie did it to the end, with Edward Scissorhands' "Dad"...so think of all the filmmakers he's obviously influenced as well...


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## ICKYVICKI (Sep 12, 2003)

I voted for Vincent Price. But I should have voted for Jack Skellington! What was I thinking?


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## Embalmer71 (Sep 25, 2007)

deadlypeanutboy said:


> Even if Jack Skellington _is_ a recent personificaiton of Jack o'Latern, I still must protest. He's just one character from one movie; a pretty goofy movie if you ask me. Now don't get me wrong, I like the film just fine, but I just don't think that Jack Skellington is representative enough to be named Patron Saint of all of Halloween.
> 
> I can't think of anything more iconic that a brightly lit pumpkin face on Halloween night.


That was my point exactly. I nominated Jack O'Lantern.


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## Reynard Muldrake (Oct 29, 2004)

Yeah, let's go with Jack O' Lantern. He's the man. Jack Skellington is ok, but things about that movie grate on me and one of them is Skellington's voice. I can still hear it in my head and it's just annoying. "What's this? What's this?". Sorry to the hardcore Nightmare Before Christmas fans.


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## Spectremaster (Oct 16, 2004)

for me it was a toss up between Vincent Price, and Boris Karloff, they both remind me of the older classics, I leaned a bit more to Boris, my vote went to him.


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## Embalmer71 (Sep 25, 2007)

VOTE O'LANTERN


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## IshWitch (May 19, 2006)

I voted for Jack.
He is the epitome of what Halloween is to me. My favorite memories as a child include carving pumpkins at Halloween. 

He is the oldest of the nominees and so therefore obviously the most endearing and enduring!

I love my dear Uncle Vinnie and what he did to spread the words of Edgar, and I love Boris and all the classic monsters, but, if you showed anyone any of these nominees' pictures the Jack O'Lantern would be the one that triggered "HALLOWEEN" in everyone's mind!

Val


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## Jack Reaper (Nov 19, 2003)

I have to go with my nomination.....Vincent Price!


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## theworstwitch (Aug 14, 2006)

DeadTed said:


> I just don't think of Jack Skellington as the epitome of Halloween. In fact, I rarely think of him at all during Halloween. I can't believe how many people here love him so much.


Real person or fictional character? I think whatever really represents Halloween to you is the right choice. For me, it's those things that trigger the powerful magic felt during the Halloweens of childhood that have built the passion I feel today.

Most of us saw "It's The Great Pumpkin Charlie Brown" enough times in our lives to recite it verbatim, so I can understand Linus holding such a dear place in our hearts. But I would think that most people in the forum are too old to have grown up watching Jack Skellington, so I too am surprised at his popularity. 

I adore Vincent and the comforting faces of the Addams and others we all grew up on, but one face that was ALWAYS there at Halloween, and represents nothing else is the one and only Jack O'Lantern. And he is more than a cartoon, he is a "real" living being (vegetables are alive!) that enters our homes every year. Seems obvious to me!


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## jlb307 (Oct 15, 2007)

I thought I'd just add that real, imaginary, doesn't matter, especially when when considering that the two current leaders are a cartoon, and the other was a myth. It's not like we're getting endorsement from the Pope or anything. It's all about fun 

Oh, and off the record.......go Vincent!


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## Embalmer71 (Sep 25, 2007)

VOTE O'LANTERN


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## DeadTed (Aug 12, 2007)

theworstwitch said:


> Real person or fictional character? I think whatever really represents Halloween to you is the right choice. For me, it's those things that trigger the powerful magic felt during the Halloweens of childhood that have built the passion I feel today.
> 
> Most of us saw "It's The Great Pumpkin Charlie Brown" enough times in our lives to recite it verbatim, so I can understand Linus holding such a dear place in our hearts. But I would think that most people in the forum are too old to have grown up watching Jack Skellington, so I too am surprised at his popularity.
> 
> I adore Vincent and the comforting faces of the Addams and others we all grew up on, but one face that was ALWAYS there at Halloween, and represents nothing else is the one and only Jack O'Lantern. And he is more than a cartoon, he is a "real" living being (vegetables are alive!) that enters our homes every year. Seems obvious to me!


AMEN, sister!

*Vote O'Lantern in 08!*


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## deadlypeanutboy (Oct 9, 2007)

Nice Slogan!

Now all we need are print ads with goofy testimonials: "Four out of five zombies support O'Lantern; shouldn't you be supporting O'Lantern, too? VOTE O'LANTERN IN 08!"

I like it!


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## DeadTed (Aug 12, 2007)

This message paid for by the Jack O' Lantern campaign for Patron Saint of Halloween


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## deadlypeanutboy (Oct 9, 2007)

*Don't Get Lost in the Crowd.....*


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## deadlypeanutboy (Oct 9, 2007)

*I Want You To Vote O'Lantern!*


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## TommyHawk (Feb 14, 2005)

Phooey on Skellington.


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## REV (Oct 26, 2007)

Ok, not trying to jump on the band wagon, but I had to vote for Jack o' Lantern. 

My 2 cents: He is the beginning, and he will be the end. He was before Price, King, etc. and he will be thought of, long after. Even though I love the stories and videos. These people were inspired from something and my guess it probably came from the myths like Jack. If Halloween was ever to meet its demiss, Jack would be the first thing to go from every door step. Not a movie, not a book. You cant kill symbols, myth or not. Jack O'lantern is like what Turkey is to Thanksgiving, Chocolate and flowers are to Valentines day, Easter Bunny is to Easter, and yes, even the ol' Jolly Saint Nick is to Christmas. Like the stories shared about him, he will wander the world forever in the hearts and minds of young and old who share in the fun of Halloween. That is something to vote for...


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## mummy dearest (Oct 29, 2007)

Those are hillarious, you two...


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## Reynard Muldrake (Oct 29, 2004)




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## deadlypeanutboy (Oct 9, 2007)

RIGHT ON!

Muldrake, DeadTed, Embalmer71, lets keep up the good fight. DOWN WITH SKELLINGTON!


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## jlb307 (Oct 15, 2007)

Reynard Muldrake said:


>


That's too funny...
I'm seeing a LOT of passion here. If I had any idea this would cause such a commotion.....I'd a done it anyway.....

But only 44 people have voted so far and just a little over a week left.....


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## Embalmer71 (Sep 25, 2007)

Reynard Muldrake said:


>



BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!! That's great!


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## Embalmer71 (Sep 25, 2007)

Does this look like the embodiment of Halloween?










I THINK NOT!!!





VOTE O'LANTERN!!!


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## Embalmer71 (Sep 25, 2007)

Also I'd like to see a Halloween.com shirt with the Patron Saint on it. Good luck getting the licensing for Skellington.


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## bethene (Feb 12, 2007)

I thought about this for a while and came to the conclusion that the Jack o'lantern should be the patron saint Of Halloween. What other figure represents both the past, present and future? Even if some one really doesn" (gasp) like halloween, they at least carve a pumpkin for their kids , nothing else is so universally associated with Halloween. Every one of us from my fellow baby boomers, to the littlest among us have had some experience with a Jack o"Lantern. It would be tied in with all the memories of halloween every one has.


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## CaptnJackSparrow (Jul 5, 2007)

_*Breaking news on HNN (the Halloween News Network)... Jack Skellington, candidate for Patron saint of Halloween has been quoted as saying HE invented Halloween, during his Junior year at FSU(Frightened State University). Sources said Jack said he and a couple former classmates dreamed up the idea during a weekend drinking binge saying there was just nothing to do between Labor Day and Thanksgiving and a "costume ball of sorts" was needed. A source close to the group reportly said, "Ah, those guys were really lacking in the brains Dept., didnt have two brain cells to rub together so I doubt they thought of something like this.." We'll bring you more detail as they develope.. The weather is next up..*_

Jack! Jack! Jack! Jack!


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## CaptnJackSparrow (Jul 5, 2007)

HARHARHARHARHARHARHARHAR!! All the posts have been a hoot! I love the t-shirts and campaign ads for JoL! Terrific! I also have to agree on Jack O' Lantern.. the history(well, tales) is there, and Skellington is just a Jackie-come-lately.. The gourd has been around a lot longer, and no one single image or character coveys the idea or thought of a holiday like Jo'L does.. My vote's for the gourd-for-brains!


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## Shadow Mistress (Oct 26, 2007)

You guys are beyond creative!!!!! Loved the line about telling "clay boy to take it back to Hot Topic" That was hilarious.


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## DeadTed (Aug 12, 2007)

The campaign is working!

Jack O' Lantern takes the lead in the polls!


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## Embalmer71 (Sep 25, 2007)

O'LANTERN WINS!!!








And check out his new look! Who says he doesn't give the people what they want?


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## mummy dearest (Oct 29, 2007)

Whew, I was worried for a second that I was going to be the "nader" vote! Voting for Poe, instead of Jack O'Lantern could have been very very bad! Glad the right man for the job won!


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## CaptnJackSparrow (Jul 5, 2007)

*HNN(Halloween News Network) reports candidate Jack Skellington is seeking a recount, saying that with such a close race, he's calling for a counting of the dangling chads which, according to Mr. Skelington, indicate he's the winner. An un-named source inside the Skellington camp reported the candidate appeared depressed and has been seen drinking heavily. "He's been so worried about this campaign he refused to eat, has lost a lot of weight, and is nothing more than bone and bone..." One has to wonder, if Jack Skellington, a dark-horse candidate, has been so worried, if he was in his right mind to run at all. At Skellington Campaign Headquarters, I'm A.G. Host reporting.. now back to the studio..*


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## DeadTed (Aug 12, 2007)

Now what?.


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## Embalmer71 (Sep 25, 2007)

DeadTed said:


> Now what?.


I dunno. Make some groundbreakers? Actually I was thinking that it would be cool to have a contest to come up with the best rendering of Jack O'Lantern. Maybe we could use the winning artist's concept for a 2008 HalloweenForum.com shirt/hoodie. What do you guys think?


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## jlb307 (Oct 15, 2007)

Embalmer71 said:


> I dunno. Make some groundbreakers? Actually I was thinking that it would be cool to have a contest to come up with the best rendering of Jack O'Lantern. Maybe we could use the winning artist's concept for a 2008 HalloweenForum.com shirt/hoodie. What do you guys think?


That's actually what I was thinking......
I'll get something started.....


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