# Extremely Simply PIR Prop Trigger



## Scary Papa

*Extremely Simple PIR Prop Trigger*

OK, as I have posted before, I have several props that are great but the problem is some of them only work when sound activated. I have been very envious of haunters who are electronically gifted and trigger their props with PIR devices and computer programs and all manner of other sofisticated triggers. Unfortunately, about all I know about electronics I can sum up in my ability to screw in a light bulb. But, never fear, I have found a solution to my problem. I had a thought that I would simply buy a driveway alert system that works on PIR (I now do know that that PIR stands for passive infared) and hook that up to one of my sound activated props. So....I went to my local Harbor Freight (discount tool) store and bought a driveway alert system. This is a two part system that has a PIR sending unit and a receiving unit. When something (or someone) passes by the PIR it sends a signal to the receiving unit and the receiver sounds a chime to let you know something is coming down your driveway. I simply put the PIR sending unit at the place where I wanted the prop to be triggered and placed the receiver in the prop next to the sound sensor. And, wonder of wonders, it worked. It worked over and over again. It worked on all my sound activated props that I tried it on. The PIR receiver has a "hi" and "low" setting for the chime. With the chime set on "low" you can barely hear the chime. It makes only a tiny electronic "ding, dong" sound. And when the prop is outside in the haunted forest with all the other sounds and distractions going on it is not noticeable at all. Additionally, you can put some sound dampening material such as closed cell foam on the back and sides of the receiver to further reduce the sound if you like. I know this is not very sofisticated and there are many more and better PIR devices and tutorials out there. But for me, in my haunted forest it works surprisingly well and the best part ...other than it worked...is it only cost $13.00 on sale. Also, since there is no wiring or prop modifications required even the electronically deficient, like me, can have a PIR activated prop. You will, however, have to learn how to install batteries.

OK UPDATE UPDATE UPDATE JUNE 13 2013 : As you read through the posts on this thread you will find a problem that I encountered. While it was hilarious for us at the Haunted Forest most haunters would not appreciate the fact that if you have more that one of these simple PIR's set up it will trigger every prop when any PIR is triggered because they all worked on the same channel. I now know (thanks to information provided by BobbyA) that you can purchase these driveway alerts that will work on different channels. You need to check above the UPC code on the box to see what channed the boxed alert works on. If you are going to use more that one be sure to buy alerts that work on different channels. They realloy do work quite well for a cheap PIR trigger.


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## CreepyCreations

That is a BRILLIANT idea!!! Simple, yet effective. And it works remotely, too! How much was the set?


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## ViennaMike

BRILLIANT indeed! I'm comfortable hooking up PIR sensors for items designed for them, but have hesitated to hack sound activated commercial props. This is a simple and cheap hack to set them off.


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## Scary Papa

CreepyCreations, the set was only $13.00 on sale at our local Harbor Freight discount tool store. Regular price runs around $24.00. However, most hardware stores will carry something similar.


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## Scary Papa

ViennaMIke, I wish I had your ability to hook up PIR's. However, this really works great for me. I may try to do something more sofisticated next year but right now this is about as technically advanced as I can get.


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## fingers

Excellent! Great idea to make the complicated simple.


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## Scary Papa

Thanks fingers. With my simple brain I need simple solutions. Just a side note. When I was working on props in my barn a couple of days ago my wife (Wicked Grandma) walked in. I had put the receiving unit in my Dracula in the Coffin prop. When she passed by the PIR Dracula came up and scared her right out from under her pointy hat. Seriously, she said it was awsome and she barely heard the tiny ding before the prop activated. And this was in my barn (which Wicked Grandma calls the dungeon of doom) with no other outside noises or distractions. Once in the haunted forest with the other sounds and distractions I'm sure it will not be noticeable at all. And since she can hear a grandkid sneeze 100 yards away I think this a good testimonial.


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## CreepyCreations

A great idea, to be sure! I've gone so far as to build a multi-staged timer circuit to handle six different scares at once, each completely independant of one another. They use PIRs, which I just love now. It's totally changed how we run our haunt now, for the better!


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## Scary Papa

CreepyCreations, I am so envious of your skills. Of course ours is just a family haunt for the grandkids and family so the grandkids think I am a genius with the very simple things I do. Maybe next year I will try something a little more complicated. However, I have been working most of the year on this Halloween so I don't know if I can ever figure the really cool stuff out.


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## CreepyCreations

To be honest, I don't think we were ready to try anything like using PIR sensors before this year. So, I just decided I'd go for it. As it turns out, I think it will all work very nicely, but it wasn't without its hardships. I think I lost 3 sensors due to shorts, voltage spikes, etc. so there were definitely some casualties along the way. However, they gave their little electronic lives so that I can scare the crap out of the ToTs! LOL We've been at this for 8 years now, so it's a learning process the whole way. You build something, you learn from it, the next build is that much better, and so on. Keep at it!!! And, have a great Halloween.


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## Scary Papa

Ok now, just a quick update from the 2012 Haunted Forest PIR project. . My very simple PIR triggers worked very well, extremely well, in fact much too well. I failed to realize that each of the driveway alerts that I purchased operated on the SAME FREQUENCY!! (Who Knew?) So when my pirate parrot that was perched on the rum keg in Pirate Cove was triggered and began to sing "What do we do with a drunken sailor?" of course my dracula rising from his coffin which was in the haunted graveyard about 100 yards away also decided to pop up and do his routine. And not to be outdone, my jumping spider located about 50 yards deeper in the grave yard also leaped from his web. Of course the same thing would happen anytime someone triggered any of the props that had this driveway PIR setup. If they triggered the jumping spider then the pirate parrot would do his rendition of "Fifteen Men on A Dead Man's Chest" while the Dracula would again tell anyone within earshot "how scary you look tonight". and all other props with the set up would do their thing as well. As it turned out this was all very hilarious and really cracked everyone up. Since our haunt is set up in walking trails through 10 acres of woods and is only for our family and friends it really didn't make much difference. But if this were a neighborhood haunt or a commercail venture some modification would be necessary. But for a cheap and easy PIR trigger I will be doing it again next year. They really did work well and the slight noise of the receiver pinging was not even noticeable. BTW...why would a company make their driveway alerts all work on the same frequency that is not modifyable? Seems to me if I have one and my neighbor has the same alert anytime someone would come up my driveway it would not only alert me but would alert my neighbor as well. Not only that but what if several neighbors have the same alert system. Then everyone would know anytime anyone came up any neighbor's driveway. Maybe the company does not figure that two or more people in the same neighborhood would buy their product. Anyway, they did work well for what I was doing but maybe not for use with a commercial haunt or one that is open to the public (unless your are using them to trigger maybe just one prop.)


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## crazy xmas

Totally cool idea!


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## CreepyCreations

Scary Papa... they make them all run on the same frequency.... (get ready for it...) because it's cheaper! They just buy ONE value of crystal/capacitor/whatever component (usually a crystal) to set the frequency it works on. That being said, it *MAY* <-- (HUGE emphasis on the "may") be possible to replace the crystal in both the transmitter and the receiver to change the frequency. I've never tried it myself, so I have no idea if it's even possible (depending on how they built the devices in the first place). A schematic of both pieces would be a big help, too.


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## notjustaphaze

cool idea..i think i could even do this..lol


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## Bump In The Night

These are on sale again at Harbor Freight Tools for $13.99

http://widgets.harborfreight.com/ws...tml&single=true&cust=99999999999&keycode=1002


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## doto

These are not on sale at Lowes in Canada....$45.00 each

http://www.lowes.ca/alarm-systems/ideal-security-sk602-wireless-safety-alert-driveway-monitoralarm_g1359160.html?isku=9704849&term=driveway alarm&linkloc=searchProductItemsImage


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## Hallomarine

"Why would a company make their driveway alerts all work on the same frequency that is not modifiable? Seems to me if I have one and my neighbor has the same alert anytime someone would come up my driveway it would not only alert me but would alert my neighbor as well. Not only that but what if several neighbors have the same alert system. Then everyone would know anytime anyone came up any neighbor's driveway. "

Scary Papa - I read this and couldn't stop laughing! My (over?) active imagination kept coming up with situation after situation. I showed my wife this and we both had a good laugh. Then my wife tells my son, and the laughter kept coming. Your neighbors, my neighbors, and neighbors here, there and everywhere gave us all a good laugh - THANK YOU! 
HM


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## Hallomarine

ok, on the serious side (hee hee) this is basically the same hack as the motion sensor, right? I don't have any sound activated props (yet) so I am always in the market for the next thing. I am also technologically challenged, and my haunt is around 50 yards long at this point. so anything I can easily use is an incredible bonus for me.
HM


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## CreepyCreations

BitN... that is one heck of a good price for the whole kit. Sadly, here in Canada I would be lucky to buy just the raw motion sensor for $13.99! We get SOOO screwed up here.


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## Scary Papa

I was surprised that these simple PIR devices are not available in Canada. I have seen them at our local Harbor Freight store for as little as $11.99. 

CreepyCreations - Thanks for the heads up on why they only work on one frequency. Cost is alway a factor I suppose. But I would be willing to pay a little more for one that would be adjustible for two or three different frequencies. Oh Well...At least everyone can laugh about it including me. Maybe this Halloween I will try a wireless doorbell. Lowes has lots of them that the chime can be adjusted to different sounds. Wonder of that would work better? I don't know if the trigger frequency would be different for the different chimes or not. Of course I COULD just learn how to make a proper PIR triggering device. But wouldn't that take a lot more work and energy on my part?


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## doto

> I was surprised that these simple PIR devices are not available in Canada. I have seen them at our local Harbor Freight store for as little as $11.99.


I didn't mean to suggest that they aren't available in Canada, They are available at Lowes In Canada, but the price is $45.00. (Just not much of a sale compared to $11.99)


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## Scary Papa

Doto, yeah I figured you were talking about the driveway alerts that Lowes carries. Our Lowes also carries driveway alerts but not the same brand as the inexpensive ones at Harbor Freight. The ones at our Lowes are more expensive as well. I guess I was thinking out loud that I was surprised you didn't have access to this inexpensive brand of driveway alert system.


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## moonwitchkitty

Wow too cool will have to try that!~~!


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## BobbyA

FWIW I have a couple of the harbor freight models. They have models with different channels. 
Just look for a little white sticker saying CH13, or CH16, etc. near the UPC on the box.
I also took one receiver out of the housing and connected it's circuit board to the 4ch leaning prop controller from Tyler & Scubaspook (see the "for sale by merchants" section).
The controller has a 3 wire connector interface for a PIR, +5vdc, Gnd, and trigger. I connected the +5vdc to where the driveway receiver's battery red wire connects. Gnd to the black, and the PIR trigger wire to the center (could have been any) of the 3 leds, on it's leg closest to the middle of the board.
The receiver triggers the controller, also gets it's power from the controller. If you need them I can take a couple pictures.


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## Scary Papa

moonwitchkitty, hope they work for you as well as they did for me.
BobbyA, I was in our local Harbor Freight today looking for just the thing you described in your post. I was certain that there should be a model that operated on more than one channel but I was not able to find any that had more than the single channel. It would be great if you could post a photo of what I should be looking for along with the price for the unit. I think the setup you made may be a little too advanced for me but if I can buy alerts that work on different channels I could control more than one prop by simply setting the driveway alert up next to the prop. As I posted earlier, the ones I bought all worked on the same frequency so all the props I had set up functioned every time any of the PIRs were triggered. By the way, if I could make the set up you described could I use the single channel alerts? They are really cheap here.


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## BobbyA

This is one of the units I picked up from HF for around $12
Perhaps they sell other brands or models when one runs out, or perhaps carry other units at other stores.
As I mentioned previously, the channel sticker is near the UPC. Hope this helps.


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## Scary Papa

BobbyA, thands for the photo. I believe I did see this at Harbor Freight yesterday. Only, I didn't notice the channel designation by the UPC code. I will be getting a couple of these today and see if they will work independently as they should. Thanks again, this really helps and will make this simple PIR trigger work on more that one prop at a time.


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## BobbyA

Glad to be of help.
I've gotten a lot of good ideas and help from the forum, it's nice to be able to return the favor.


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## theworstwitch

I've never used any kind of thing like this. How large does something have to be to set off the motion detector? I'm thinking about small animals, birds, etc...


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## Scary Papa

theworstwitch, anything that passes in front of the PIR sending unit will set of the alert (or in our case the sound activated prop). However, if you mount the PIR about 3 feet off the ground most animals that pass by will not trigger the PIR. If you use this idea and are going to use it to trigger more than one prop be sure to follow BobbyA's post and check above the UPC code on the box and get alerts that work on different channels. Otherwise everytime one PIR is triggered every prop you have set up on these alerts will activate as I mentioned happened to me in this original thread.

BobbyA, well I went back to Harbor Freight today and I found the driveway alerts that you were talking about. I bought 3, each on a different channel. Also, (and I am really embarrased to admit this) I discovered the driveway alerts that I had previously purchased also had a channel designation above the UPC code on the box. I just happened to buy several that operated on the same channel which was channel 11. I discovered this when I got home and checked the boxes for my original alert purchase. Thanks again for being smart enough to check the boxes and for passing this information along in a post on this thread.


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## Chops6965

Once again, ingenuity rears it's ugly head and we all benefit! Great idea Scary Papa!! 

Crap, now I have another project...lol


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## BobbyA

Someone asked how this was connected. In this picture the circuit board that was removed from Harbor Freight driveway chime receiver is near the top of the picture. The lower board is a 4-button learning controller (described in the "for sale by merchants" threads). The controller is wired to provide the standard configuration you will find with PIR modules. Typically they have a 3 wire interface, which connects Ground, +5vdc, and the trigger signal. The controller looks for the trigger signal to briefly change from high (5V) to low (()V) when motion is detected.

The Harbor Freight (HF) receiver board appears like a wired PIR module to the prop controller. To use the HF receiver in this manner, open the case and remove the circuit board. Cut the red (power) & black (ground) wires near the battery spring clips. You can also cut the green wires connecting the chime speaker disk. The red and black wires then connect to the prop controller, which now provides the voltage to run the receiver board via the prop controller's PIR 3-pin connector. Next you will need to connect a trigger signal wire from the 3rd pin of that connector (white wire in the picture), to one of the red LEDs on the receiver (again see picture). When the transmitter detected motion the receiver would normally chime and flash the red LEDs. To do that the receiver supplies a ground connection for the led, this makes the voltage on that diode lead go to 0 volts. Which is just the signal change needed to trigger the prop controller.

If you are not using a prop controller, and just want to make the receiver act like a switch. You can use a small relay similar to an Omron G6K-2 in place of one of the red LEDs. Cut one of the leds, and wire the relay coil to the remaining leads. Then use the normally open (NO) contacts on the relay to replace a footpad or similar switch for your prop. In this use you will need to keep the receiver's battery compartment connected, or provide another power supply via the side power connector.


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## Scary Papa

BobbyA, I am wondering if when using the driveway alert simply as a switch as you mentioned is it really necessary to wire in a relay. I tried it by just cutting the wires to a sound sensor on one of my less expensive props and soldering the ends of these wires to the leads of one of the LED lights. It seems to work great. I though I was following your instructions but I forgot the relay.


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## BobbyA

Ah that reminds me of my motto; I'd rather be lucky than good.

Sounds like you might have got lucky.


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## medicf43

They have been marked down selling for 17.99 now. http://www.harborfreight.com/wireless-driveway-alert-system-93068.html


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## BobbyA

medicf43 said:


> They have been marked down selling for 17.99 now. http://www.harborfreight.com/wireless-driveway-alert-system-93068.html


I am confident you can do better than $17.99


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## Scary Papa

BobbyA...Ok since I am not tech savy I am wondering if by lucky you mean I didn't electrocute myself , or the prop worked despite my ineptitude.LOL Actually I am planning on attempting to do this the correct way althought the prop is working. I am concerned that without the relay the prop may get damaged with too much current going to the swith or something. Also is there a radio shack substitute for this relay. I looked on the Omron website and there are several G6K-2 type relays with different letters at the end (G6K-2P, G6K-2G, G6K-2Y etc.). I don't relaly know which one to get so if I know the specs I can get one at the local radio shack.


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## BobbyA

Hi Scary,
By lucky meant that the prop sound sensor didn't clutch it's little chest and expire. 
The fact it is working now says it will probably work later, so I'm not sure you need to change anything for this prop. 
Lucky in like checking if a medium tap w/ a hammer on the glass will not break it, It might not but if it does, it's done. 

As I recall the suffix on the relays -2G -2Y etc just indicate how long and what shape the connecting leads are.
I picked this model because I have used it before on 4 to 5V circuits to power the coil (operate the relay), but other brands are available. 
If looking for the Omrons, I would try feebay, and just get the datasheet from Omron's website. 
Try search for this term on feebay: Omron G6k relay


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## Scary Papa

Thanks BobbyA, I really appreciate your info. Glad to know that my prop will most likely not explode in my face. As I said this is a cheap sound activated prop so probably that is why it worked ok without the relay. Going to try to use this on some more expensive sound activated props so I will definitely add the relay to this setup.


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## CDW

ScaryPapa, regarding the relay, I think you and BobbyA are talking about different things. BobbyA is talking about wiring in a relay to replace something like a step pad trigger, a try-me button, or a switch on the power supply of an always-on prop, where the prop is triggered by completing a connection (closing the switch). When the PIR is triggered, it sends a voltage on the LED wire, which activates the relay, closing the switch. You're working with a sound sensor, which isn't activated by closing a switch, but by applying a voltage generated in the microphone to a sensor. If you just wired a relay into a sound sensor circuit, there's no guarantee it would trigger reliably, because all you'd be doing is completing the connection to the microphone. By applying the voltage from the PIR signal wire to the sound sensor directly, you're reproducing the effect of the microphone generating a voltage, which is the correct way to trigger that kind of sensor. BobbyA is right, though, that you're lucky; a sound sensor like that probably isn't meant to receive any significant amount of power, so putting a voltage intended to light an LED into it could have easily burned out the sensor. If it works, that's great, it's just not something you can rely on to work with other props. A safer way would be to determine how much voltage the microphone might typically put out, and then use a relay like BobbyA suggested to put only that much against the sensor. I've seen people use a single AA battery (1.5V) for this sort of application, so you'd probably be safe with that, but it may require some testing to find out what the threshold trigger voltage is.


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## Scary Papa

CDW, thanks so much for your additional input. I am begining to understand the complexities of hacking this alert system. So, since I am totally inept at electronics and circuits and basically do not understand anything about this, I am thinking I will just go back to my original idea of a simple to set up and use PIR alert that uses the sound from the driveway alert to trigger a sound activated prop.


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## BobbyA

Yes I kind of got off on a tangent trying to explain the hack for those wishing to trigger props through their Step pad, try me, or other switch port.
Scary, if you wish to use the sound output you can also remove the little speaker and extend it's wires enough to place it over (or near) the prop's sound sensor.
In the case where you don't want any sound, you could likely start off with a high resistance (1 meg ohm ?) resistor in series with your direct connection, to limit the chance of damaging the prop. If that isn't enough voltage to trigger the prop, keep cutting the resistor value in half (1 meg ohm becomes 500K, then 250K, etc.) until it reliably triggers from the chime signal.


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## Scary Papa

Hey BobbyA,well alrighty then. I think I may be able to do this. As I understand it I can (1) use the speaker on the driveway alert and simply remove it from the case and add wiring to the speaker to extend it to be near the sound sensor on the prop or (2) if I do not want any sound coming from the speaker I can cut the speaker wire and add a resistor as you described between one lead from an LED light on the alert and one of the the wires of the sound sensor microphone (or whatever it is called) that I remove from the prop. in this application the speaker on the alert would be cut out completely and the speaker wires would not be used for anything. As I have said before the sound of the driveway alert on low setting really cannot be heard in the Haunted Forest with all the other noises but I might be skilled enough to try this to eliminate it completely. However, I believe I am right that if I decided to try to ue this system to replace a "try me" button I would need to use the realy as you mentioned before. Here is a simple drawing of what I think I am doing to cut out the speaker.


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## BobbyA

Hey Scary, That should work.
I was also thinking that you could be better off to take a 10uf capacitor and use the wires that went to the speaker and connect them to the wires that went to the sound sensor. 
In you diagram above you would change the words "led light leads" to the words " speaker wires", and change the "appropriate size resistor" to "10uf capacitor".
If it is a very expensive prop I might leave a 10K or so resistor in line as you have it shown, and put the capacitor in series with it. 

Confused yet ? lol


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## Scary Papa

BobbyA, WOW! Information overload. By the time you are finished with me I will be an electronics techniician for sure.. Seriously, I really appreciate all the help. However, in accordance with my life long rule to "never do anything for yourself that you can get someone else to do for you " I am trying to figure out some way for you to just do this for me. I don't suppose you would want to take a trip to Missouri would you? Well maybe I can muddle through with your excellent guidance. Does it make any difference if the capacitor is in line before or after the resistor? In other words between the receiver speaker wire and resistor or between the resistor and the prop? Also, do you think this circuit would work to replace a motion sensor photo cell trigger? Thanks again.


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## BobbyA

Oh Scary that is unfortunate, our rules seem to be in conflict on this. My rule is: Never put off for tomorrow that,
which I can get out of entirely. 

I would be happy to take questions, make suggestions, or help troubleshoot. As for the light sensor, I don't think I have taken one of the props apart to see how they did them. So the short answer is, I don't know. I could do it with how I would have designed the light sensor, but that may not be how they will have done it.

Keep things simple, put the resistor in one wire, and the capacitor in the other wire. lol 
Either can come first if placed in the same wire.
For electrical things to work, what ever goes up one wire has to come back on the other. (probably more than you wanted to know, I do that sometimes...).
The purpose of the resistor is to keep the energy intended to drive the speaker from overloading the sound sensor circuit.
The purpose of the capacitor is to block DC voltages, and only let the chime signal get through to the sound circuit.
Don't use the capacitor if you are going to connect to the receiver's LED.


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## Scary Papa

Thanks again BobbyA. Oh Man...I thought for sure I could figure out some way for you to do this for me but it looks like our two opposing philosophies are like matter and anti-matter coming together. Not a good thing. Actually, I am not completely inept at electrical circuits. By this I mean I can handle household wiring and circuits like that. I can handle these circuits just fine. But I know next to nothing about electronics so this is where I am having trouble understanding what comes first the capacitor or the egg....errr I mean the resistor. I knew that resistors would allow only a certain amount of energy to get through based on their design but I thought capacitors stored energy until a switching component of some sort triggered it to release the stored energy. So I was trying to figure out how the energy from the capacitor was going to be released without adding something like a transistor or something to the circuit. Now I know that I didn't know what I thought I knew. Or something like that anyway. I am planning on giving this another try tomorrow. I do think I am going to try the wiring circuit that utilizes the speaker wires simply because it will be easier for me to solder these wires and not melt any connections on the circuit board than attempting to solder onto the leg of the LED light. As I said before I greatly appreciate all your help and patience with my somewhat dumb questions. And if I don't electrocute myself in the process I will let you know how it turns out. BTW...there really isn't any chance that if the prop gets a sudden burst of energy it will come alive and attack me like Frankenstein's Monster is there?


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## tinafromidaho

I just saw this on pinterest. Thank you for such a simple solution to a gigantically annoying problem.


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## Scary Papa

tinafromidaho, Glad you like this idea. I don't know how it got on Pinterest but I'm happy that you found it. It really does work well for a simple PIR trigger. However, be sure to try some of the modifications that BobbA has posted here. They are not difficult and they make the prop trigger even better.


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## HallowweenKat

BobbyA said:


> I am confident you can do better than $17.99


Where can I get the $10.99 coupon? Would like to try some of these. Thanks.


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## BobbyA

Two possibilities come to mind. 
1. Look in the local newspaper.
2. Do a print screen.


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## HallowweenKat

Thanks ... I don't get the newspaper & it says right on the image "original coupon must be presented" so I cannot use a printed up image. Bummer.


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## Scary Papa

Halloweenkat,ok try these ideas. First I would print the coupon that BobbyA posted and march right down to the local Harbor Freight store and buy a driveway alert or 2. But this coupon is only good until July 31 so you better hurry. I think they will accept the coupon as it looks like it might be from an on line ad but if this fails go to Harborfreight.com. They usually have a page of coupons. If this driveway alert isn't listed with a coupon try the next week. Keep trying until they finally put it on sale with a coupon. When you find it just print out the coupon. I know from doing this myself that our local Harbor Freight store will accept any coupon that you print from their on line ad. These driveway alerts are listed quite often locally in a Sunday newspaper ad page. Like you I do not subscribe to the local paper so I get my Harbor Freight ad every Sunday from a relative who does get the paper. Also, if you go to the local Harbor Freight store they always have a flyer with coupons and many times they have these driveway alerts listed. While I have never seen them locally as low as $10.99 I have purchased several here for $12.99 on sale. Sometimes they are put on sale with no requirement for a coupon. Also, I have never found any store here that will not accept their online coupon that you have an image of on your smart phone so this might also be a possibility. Another possibility is to subscribe to Harbor Freight's monthly ad. I get a new ad flyer every month in the mail with lots of coupons as well as a 20% off coupon on any purchase. If all else fails I will be happy to send you a PM the next time I see them on sale here or send you a coupon by snail mail. I am assuming that if something is on sale at Harbor Freight locally it will be on sale in all their stores. Usually you can purchase up to 6 using only 1 coupon and I noticed that the coupon that BobbyA posted offers a limit of 6. If you do buy more that one be sure to get each one that works on a different channel.


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## HallowweenKat

Was able to get 3 of them this morning, different channels, at the $10.99 price. Thanks again for all the help.


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## Scary Papa

Halloweenkat, I am glad that you were able to get your driveway alerts. Be sure to try the modifications that BobbyA posted to make them even better.


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## Immortalia

I just picked up 3 of these last weekend, they work like a charm. Thanks for the outstanding idea!!!


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## medicf43

I picked up a few the other day but the ones in my HF did have the channel number on the box, i asked an employee and he didnt know why it was now missing


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## Scary Papa

Hey BobbyA, just finished one of the driveway alert modifications that you have been helping me with. I tried the extend the speaker wire trick because it looked to be the easiest to start out on. I removed the speaker from the alert, extended the wiring and put it next to the sound sensor in my zombie groundbreaker. It worked great. Next I'm going to attempt the modification with the capacitor to bypass the speaker altogether. Then MAYBE I will be confident enough to think I can do the relay option for one of my props with a "try me" button. Possibly my animated pirate parrot.


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## BobbyA

Glad to hear it Scary. 
You can also insert a resistor inline with either of the speaker wires and lower the volume of the chime if that is useful for you.


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## Scary Papa

Thanks BobbyA, I think I will try that resistor idea. I did notice that when I just held the alert speaker above the sound sensor of the prop it was practically inaudible even on the Hi setting. And it triggered the prop beautifully. But after I hot glued it down the sound level was louder and about the same as when it was in the alert. Not quite sure why. Anyway, do you think a 10K resister would be about the right size? I have several of diffrent values that I bought to work on this project with.


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## BobbyA

Sure, trying a 10k sounds like a good choice. If it still too loud you can add another 10k in series, if it is a little too low then place a second 10K resistor in parallel with the first (will now equal 5K)


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## BobbyA

BTW for the folks considering getting the driveway alerts (more than one that is), I checked them out again today at HF.
HF is now selling two model numbers. 
Model 93068 is the one I bought with the channel numbers (ie. CH18) on the outside of the box. 
Model 69590 looks very similar, but slightly different picture on the packaging, and those boxes do not display any channel number.


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## Scary Papa

BobbyA, I'm on it. The alert really isn't too loud at all right now but why not make it even quieter. I will be installing the resistor today.


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## Scary Papa

BobbyA, that 10K resistor worked great! I put my ear right next to the speaker and I didn't hear anything (of course my wife says I never hear anything anyway). But seriously, there did not seem to be a sound coming from the speaker but the prop triggered perfectly. I activated it over and over and it never failed to trigger. Now on to the capacitor then next up....the relay. And finally the big kahuna. The PROP CONTROLLER. Wish me luck.


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## Scary Papa

BobbyA, well, I was not able to work with the capacitor. It seems that all of my sound activated props that I was going to use the driveway PIR system on did not have sound sensors that I could get to to be able to cut the wire to the sensor. They were all enclosed in a plastic case so I just did the "extend the PIR speaker wire" trick and added the resistor. So far I have adapted this driveway alert PIR system to my Larry the Zombie groundbreaker, my talking pirate parrot, my jumping spider, my Dracula rising from his coffin and my small sleeping skeleton that I hacked into a large snoring skeleton. They all work great. So now I am going for the relay option. Up to now I have been happyly working away, blissfully ignorant of the truly correct way to set this up and satisfied with the results despite my poor soldering skills; but it seems to be working out ok. However, now since I am going to be installing the relay to trigger props with the "Try Me" button I know that I will have to be a little more intelligent about how to correctly make the circuit and the proper size relay to use. Good thing I printed all the information that you have provided to help me.

I also checked out the local Harbor Freight store to see what was up with the alerts with no channel operation designation. I found them here as well. I did notice that while the box did not have a channel designation it did say what frequency they operated on. All of them here operated on 433 mhz. Maybe the new models just have the operation fewquency and not the channel. Who knows?


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## BobbyA

Hi Scary, Congratulations on getting most of you stuff working w/ the alerts. 
I'll try to give you more detailed help as you take on the relays if you wish.
Let me know what part number of relays you end up with, or plan to get.

As for the 433MHz, it's more likely just there to refer to the band they are one. 
Kind of like the UHF or VHF set of channels on TV. 
The bands these could be on are around 318MHz, 433MHz, 900MHz, 2.4GHz etc.
The other alerts are likely on 433MHz too, either tuned to slightly different places around 433HMz, or more likely they just send a different coding on the same frequency.
At the risk of oversimplifying it's kind of like there is a jumper inside that tells the receiver when it hears a transmitter yell "number 14", that's your cue to act, if you hear "Number 18" or any other number just ignore it. So if two are listening for "Number 14" both will likely act. Which in some setups can be used to your advantage, allowing two (or more) things to be triggered by the same TOT.


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## Scary Papa

Thanks BobbyA, I will definitely need some additional help I am sure. I going to try to figure out what relays to buy here at Radio Shack if I can get the proper ones. My first attempt will be to work on my Headless Harry prop since I have two of them. If I kill my old one I will still have a new one that I just purchased. I'm gonig to go to the Omron website again and try to find out what the value of that G6K-2G relay is to match it with a Radio Shack model. Never worry about oversimplification with me. I am really a simpleton when it comes to electronics. By the way....Is a 1 megaohm resistor the same as as a 10K resistor? The folks here at Radio Shack said they were the same but I am suspicious of that. Isn't a 1 meg resistor 1 million ohms and a 10 k resistor 10 thousand ohms?


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## CreepyCreations

Those two resistors are NOT the same. 1 million ohms = 1000K ohms, compared to 10K ohms. 100 times higher!


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## BobbyA

CreepyCreations said:


> Those two resistors are NOT the same. 1 million ohms = 1000K ohms, compared to 10K ohms. 100 times higher!


You are both correct, the amount of resistance is not the same. However not to defend RS employees but those resistors can be the same in other ways.
For instance they could fit in the same physical PCB holes, and can handle the same amount of power (1/8W, 1/4W, etc) based on their physical size. 

@scary it is likely most of the guys at radio shack will not be knowledgeable enough to help you pick a relay. 
IMHO best you are likely to get from them if they can find relays in the store is a match to the coil voltage, ie. "this one says it works at 12V"

Scary if you don't mind spending $12.50 to get 10 of them, in your position I would buy these. You are buying more than you probably need, but are not going to get relays for $1.25ea at RS, much less the right ones. 
http://www.ebay.com/itm/10-pcs-OMRO...671?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item232ddc1df7


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## Scary Papa

CreepyCreations, yeah that's just what I thought. I'm not very smart but I thought I did remember that when I went to school 1 million didn't equal 1 thousand.

BobbyA, thank you for this info. I am really not opposed to spending $12.50 for these. Expecially since I will probably burn up some of them with my less than stellar soldering skills.

Just got the order in for the relays so now I can't wait to get them installed and see how amazed my grandkids will be when these props actually work for a change.


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## crutherf

on another note.... if you just need the PIR trigger portion (without the remote "trigger by radio" capability) they (Harbor Freight) have a cheaper version with 6 white LED lights and a PIR sensor. They are around $9, I just bought one to experiment with.


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## BobbyA

This one can get you there for $2. If you can figure out where to connect it for your use.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Hot-1-PCS-P...445?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f27d48f85


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## crutherf

BobbyA said:


> This one can get you there for $2. If you can figure out where to connect it for your use.
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Hot-1-PCS-P...445?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f27d48f85


Nice... haven't seen that one before. Looks like a similar one I bought a year or two ago for about 5 dollars.

Thanks for the tip...


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## Scary Papa

BobbyA, The mail came today and guess what? I had a package from the relay guys. I thought this can't be the relays because it was just a small envelope and I had ordered 10 relays for cryin' out loud. And they should be in a big box or something. Well, I tore open the envelope and out fell this little rectangular, clear tube. I shook the envelope and nothing else came out. I thought crap...I ordered something else by mistake. Now what am I going to do with this little tube with what looked like two long rows of small hairs inside. Then I suddenly realized (after I got out my magnifying glass), OMG! there are 10 relays inside this tube!. I couldn't believe it. I have pumpkin seeds that are bigger than these relays.. They sure looked larger in the photographs. Anyway, they are here and now I have to figure out how I am going to solder those little wires for this thing to work. I'm digging out the instructions you posted and getting ready to spread my wings and venture into the world of electronic relays. I think I better get a sharper soldering tip for my soldering iron.


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## BobbyA

Now that's Scary isn't it ? lol Sorry I couldn't resist. 

Okay, you are probably going to want to get a smaller solder tip. There are a couple tricks you can use to make this a bit easier.
Set the solder iron down or put it in a small vise, wrap a bit of wire around each of the two relay legs you want to connect to (I'll look them up in a minute).
You can then hold the relay in one hand, and the solder in the other, and bring both to the solder iron tip.
Those two wires should be long enough to exit the plastic case, and be connected to the length of wire going to the "Try me button" connector.

When you have the two wires soldered in place. Place some solder on the relay's two power pins. 
For this next step you should give a little thought on which led to chose, and what side to use, based on ultimately gluing the relay to something that can support it. 
Power for the relay will come from cutting one of the 3 red LEDs off it's leads. You probably want to leave as much led lead sticking up as you can.
Place some solder on the cut end of the leads, and spread them so they are about the same distance apart as the relay pins are.
Hold the relay so one of it's power pins is by one of the led leads. Solder them by just melting the two solder blobs. Then do the other lead. 
Using something like needle-nose pliers bend the led leads so the relay is near something it can be glued to.
It's a very small relay so that last step in almost optional, and can wait until you make sure everything is working.

Now for which pins: Holding the relay so you can read the text on top normally. 
I am going to describe positions with you looking at the top, but of course the pins are on the bottom, so you will have to keep track when you roll it over.
The short black stripe in the lower left corner indicates pin number 1.
Pin to the right of that is number 2, then 3, etc.
Directly up from pin 1 is pin number 8 (by the word ":Omron") then 7, 6, and 5. 
So if you have if correctly, pin 4 should be across from pin 5. Pin 1 should be in the lower left corner, and pin 5 in the upper right.

The two "try me" wires will be connected to pins 3 & 4.
The led leads will connect to pins 1 & 8. 
There are a couple ways to figure out which led lead goes to pin 1 (the + voltage) .
I think the leds are turned on by supplying them ground (negative connection), with positive voltage on them all the time.
If you have a volt meter, connect the black lead to the black wire (negative) coming off the receiver batteries.

With the receiver turned on (doesn't need transmitter to activate) the meter's red lead should indicate +4.5v on one of the led leads. 
That lead will be connected to relay pin 1, with the other led lead going to pin 8. 

Good luck, and feel free to ask questions.


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## Scary Papa

Well yeah BobbyA,, let's all make fun of poor old Scary Papa while he is making a feeble attempt at manipulating an impossibly small relay into position to solder it onto a tiny LED wire coming from an small electronic board and then attatch it somehow to a hair thin "Try Me" botton wire all for the sole purpose of scaring he wadding out of his grandkids.. Well, now that I think of it is is pretty funny. Anyway, I'm in too deep to quit now and thank you for the additional information. I will take it one step at a time. Also, the tip on soldering you gave me is great. It will help a lot. And beleive me when I say I will be asking more questions. By the way...didn't I see somewhere where I can just buy a board that this stuff plugs into..LOL


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## BobbyA

Yes there is a board you can buy that this stuff will plug into, but you still will need to solder the wires. 
So might as well skip the extra step of the board.
Do you see the period at the end of the above sentence ? I have capacitors that small, this relay is huge, what are you talking about ?


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## Scary Papa

BobbyA, I am amazed. I can't believe you have capacitors as small as that period. My wife is really enjoying this. She says you are just getting me in deeper and deeper. She sees me sitting at the computer just scratching my head and mumbling to myself saying "seriously, he expects me to be able to do this?" Well here is my understanding of what I have to eventually be able to do. Is this correct?


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## BobbyA

Hi Scary, You're close but the positive + voltage from the led should go to pin 1 of the relay.


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## Scary Papa

Ok BobbyA, I got a multimeter AND a new soldering iron. Got this and all the other stuff together and began studying the problem. Finally inspiration came when my wife (Wicked Grandma) said, "are you going to just look at that all night or do something with it?" Did I mention that she's the meanest woman in five counties?  Anyway, I went at it. However, when I checked the voltage on the LED leads the most voltage I got was 2.95v. And it fluctuated pretty wildly. I did check the batteries in the receiving unit and they were all good so I figured I was doing something wrong. Also, I didn't get any reading at all until I used the PIR sending unit too. There would be no reading until the PIR triggered the receiver and the LED's lit up. While they were flashing I would get a reading. So, I just hooked up the relay to use that lead that I got a + reading on. Too bad that I didn't read your instructions a little more closely or see your last post sooner as I hooked the + to the #8 pin. Crap...no wonder I didn't get any reading on the meter when I checked the ends of the wires that go to the "Try Me" button. At least I didn't glue down the relay yet. Ah.....now might be a good time to tell me what the second way to determine what the postitive LED lead is. Or maybe I should dust off my old volt meter and use it rather than the multimeter. By the way...how DO I check to see if this is sending the right signal to the "Try Me" button wires? I can't believe I had to solder that little white speck in the photo to the LED leads. But somehow I got it done and it seems to be tight. Unfortunately, now I have to desolder it and then solder it back again. I bought a new roll of solder. I hope I have enough I think my head is going to explode.


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## BobbyA

First, the "try me" button is just a switch. 
There shouldn't be any voltage coming out of the relay wire, at least while they are not connected to the prop.
The prop puts out a voltage on one of the wires, when the try me switch (Or the relay) sends the voltage back on the other wire, the prop activates.


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## BobbyA

I'll look tomorrow and post which led wires to connect to which relay pins.


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## BobbyA

Okay Scary, and anyone else following along. 
The HF driveway receiver's 3 LEDs leads closest to the edge of the receiver board are - or ground and will connect to pin 8 of the Omron G6K relay.
The other LED lead is the + or positive voltage and will connect to pin 1 on the relay.
Whenever the receiver's LEDs flash the relay contacts on pins 3 & 4 will close briefly, acting like a switch. 
In this case a "try me" button/switch if connected to the "try me" port of some Gemmy & Tekky props.

FYI: If anyone wants to go further, you can add another pair of wires to the other pins for more functions. 
When the relay briefly activates, a connection between pins 7 & 6 will go open, a connection between pins 6 & 5 will close. 
This might be useful to trigger another device, or flash an LED (1A or less current) light to attract attention to the prop.


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## Scary Papa

Hey BobbyA, thank you so very much for this information. I did figure out that the LED lead closest to the edge of the board was the (-) only because I got a (+) reading on the other leads. Silly me...I didn't know there would not be any voltage coming out of the wires leading to the "Try Me" button wires. I thought when the current went to the LED there would also be current coming from the relay. I should have known this but I guess I just didn't think it through. I really appreciate all your help with this. All of this training would cost me a lot at electronics training classes here. Wait a minute....your aren't going to send me a bill for all of this later are you?


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## BobbyA

"Wait a minute....your aren't going to send me a bill for all of this later are you?"

My rate is either $50 hr or free. 
You got the free one. Happy to help.


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## Here2scareU

What a great idea!


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## BobbyA

@Scary. 
Funny I was just rereading the first part of this thread. In post #24 I mentioned which leg of the LED had the signal. 
They say memory is the first thing to go, I can't recall what goes 2nd...


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## Scary Papa

BobbyA, I'm sure glad that I got in on the "free" special. How long is this special deal going to run by the way? Because...ta daaaa...now it is trouble shoot time. I just came in from the dungeon of doom where I performed a perfect surgery on my Heads Up Harry prop from Spirit Halloween. I checked him out before the surgery and he worked perfectly. Then I opened up his base and spliced in two wires to his wires going to the "Try Me" button and ran them outside the base. I didn't want to remove the try me button just in case I wanted to use it again sometime. I put him back together and tested him out again. He worked perfectly again on both the motion sensor and the try me button. Then I tested my new connection. I touched the ends of the wires that I had spliced into him together and voila....he worked like a charm. Just like making the connection with the try me button. Up to this point everything is going great. Now I get my driveway alert that I had just finished redoing after realizing from you instructions I had wired the #1 pin to the wrong LED lead. Then I hooked up the wires from Pin #'s 3 & 4 to the wires from Harry's try me button but nothing happened. And yes, before you ask, I did remember to turn the receiver on. That's the first thing I checked by the way. Both the PIR sending unit and the receiver were working. I double checked all the connections between the relay and the receiver and they all appear to be correct. I even took out the receiver's batteries and plugged in a 6V power supply just in case the batteries were weak. Next I figured that I had burned up one of the LED leads while trying to solder the relay into place so I unsoldered it and moved it to another LED light lead that I knew was still good. Still no joy. I then used a couple of jumper wires and a new LED light to test the original LED leads that I had used and the light lit up. So it was getting power to these LED leads when the PIR sent the signal. Finally, I used a jumper wire to jump power directly from the (+) connection at the battery compartment to the (+) LED lead where the relay was attached. And it worked. Harry did his routine just like he was supposed to. So I figured the relay was working and I did not destroy it while soldering it in. Of course, this solution provided constant power to the relay so it did not work with the PIR sending unit. But each time I touched the wire from the battery compartment to the (+) LED lead in the receiver the relay would trigger Harry. Harry runs on a 9V DC 1.5 amp power supply in case that is important. And now for the big question....what is wrong? Do you have any suggestions? This project has now become a mission (my wife says "obsession") and I just have to get this figured out. I know the solution to this problem is something really simple but I just have no idea what to do now. I am wondering if maybe I didn't get the wires I spliced into Harry's try me button wires in the right place. I spliced into the wires that were wired into the try me button. I have to get this finished or my wife will have a HUGE story to tell all our friends and then they will point their fingers at me and say, "HA, you're not so scary. You can't even make a simple prop trigger work" You wouldn't want that on your conscience would you? In an attempt to see if maybe it was just that the Harry prop was the problem I also spliced in wires to the try me button on my pirate parrot but it didn't work on this prop either. Any help will be greatly appreciated. I am still on the free special, right?


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## kentuckyspecialfx.com

I would be glad to help, im actually a electronics eng.
I've been following the post and was curios as to continuity reading on the PIR itself was.
Over the years ive destroyed a few of those alert things to get parts when we were out in the field but I cant remember if its a four pin or just three i do remember that just because you see the red light pop on the pir does not mean its actually being triggered in some past hacks on those things I remember that..
Im guessing on this but from what ive read and can remember I think the battery and supply are different inputs on those things to keep the batteries from getting hit with power if you have batteries in them when you hook up a power supply.
Your more than welcome to post a few pics and any readings from a dvm and i will do my best to help if you want it.
BTW our hourly shop rate is 85.00 per hour but i'll settle for a subway sandwich with cool ranch chips. lol


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## BobbyA

Okay Scary, lets get back to simple. I'd like you to put Harry back on battery power and then try using your jumper to energize the relay again. 
It's not very important that Harry be on batteries, it will just make thing simpler for now, if that test works okay.

Sorry you have had to move things around. 
From what you have said, my first guess at what could be happening is the LED flash (and relay close) might be too short for Harry to notice.
After you verify Harry will work on batteries with you making the relay close. What I would like you to do is place your meter across the wires coming off pins 3 & 4 ( while not connected to Harry) and in continuity mode look for the meter to briefly register when the LEDs flash. We want to make sure the relay is being turned on by the leds.
If the relay does cause the meter to register, then reconnect the wires to Harry's try me circuit and use your jumper to again check that energizing the relay for longer will activate Harry. 
Let me know what you see.


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## BobbyA

kentuckyspecialfx.com said:


> I would be glad to help, im actually a electronics eng.
> I've been following the post and was curios as to continuity reading on the PIR itself was.
> Over the years ive destroyed a few of those alert things to get parts when we were out in the field but I cant remember if its a four pin or just three i do remember that just because you see the red light pop on the pir does not mean its actually being triggered in some past hacks on those things I remember that..
> Im guessing on this but from what ive read and can remember I think the battery and supply are different inputs on those things to keep the batteries from getting hit with power if you have batteries in them when you hook up a power supply.
> Your more than welcome to post a few pics and any readings from a dvm and i will do my best to help if you want it.
> BTW our hourly shop rate is 85.00 per hour but i'll settle for a subway sandwich with cool ranch chips. lol


Thank you for the offer, can always use another pair of eyes. In this case since the PIR is in a wireless transmitter, as long as the receiver's leds or chime activate then we can assume the pir is okay.


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## Scary Papa

kentuckyspecialfx, thanks for the offer to help. I can certainly use all the assisance I can get. And the price is certainly within my abiliby to pay. As BobbyA said this PIR is working as when I trigger it as the LED's light up and the chime will ring...or at least it did until I cut the speaker out for his project. Also, the PIR only works on a 9v battery. There is no option on the PIR for an external power source. The reciever does have this option however.

BobbyA, as soon as I get home from work I will be out in the dungeon of doom to work on this some more. I will take the steps you requested and let you know the outcome. When you ask that Harry be put on battery power are you talking about Harry's power or using the battery power in the alarm receiver. Harry himself doesn't have a battery compartment. He only works on 9V external power. I am taking off work tomorrow to devote my entire life to making this work. I think you are absolutely right in thinking the relay may be closing for too short a time period for it to register with Harry. I checked him out this morning before work and when I just touched the wires together that I spliced in to Harry's try me botton wireing he works but I did notice that if I just very quickly struck the wires tigether he would not get the message. I hope there is a fix for this if this is the problem.


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## BobbyA

Hi Scary, yes there is a fix for it. We just have to figure out which one is the easiest to implement there.
From your quick check with the momentary connection of Harry's "try me" wires it sounds like we are on the right track.

First thing I'd like to try is:
Using one of the capacitors from the speaker wire to sound sensor effort, (around 10uf would be good) I want to try fooling harry into thinking the relay is on longer than it is.
This working depends things a bit complicated to go into here, so it very well might not work. I would like you to use you meter on the voltage scale and see if you can determine which of Harry's try me wires is more positive compared to the other one. The cap may only indicate which is it's minus or negative terminal, positive will be the other one. lol 
Connect the capacitor plus side to the most positive try me wire. The cap's minus lead will go to Harry's other wire. 
Reconnect the wires from the relay to Harry and see if it got better. If that doesn't do it, try a bigger cap, or place another cap in parallel with the first. Two beats one theory. 
Speaking of theories, what I am hoping is that Harry has a high impedance circuit supplying the try me wire. That if the try me wire has to charge up the cap before it can again reach it's regular voltage level, (after we drain the cap with the relay's pins 3 & 4 switch) Harry will notice the try me line is low before Harry's circuit can finish recharging the cap.


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## BobbyA

If you don't have a 10uf or bigger on hand and go RS or similar to buy one, up to about 50uf could likely be used instead.

The working voltage will be under 10v so don't bother buying a 50V or 100V cap. 
Think of this number like amp/hour or car battery model size. We need 12V (is not something we actually need) battery that can start a lawn mower, a car battery also puts out 12V and would start a lawn mower, but is larger, more expensive (or should be), and overkill for our use.


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## Scary Papa

Ok, BobbyA, I will do this task just as soon as I get home this afternoon. By the way, how will I know which wire lead will be more positive? I will put the (+) test lead on one of the wires but where will I put the (-) test lead? On the other wire then switch them to see when is more positive? As usual I am a little confused on the fine details. Here is a photo of the wires to Harry's try me button. The yellow wires go to the try me button and the green wires go to the motion sensor. I spliced in about 6 inches from the try me botton base. I took this photo before I spliced in the external wiring.


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## BobbyA

You need to have test leads (or probes) on both wires at the same time. I am calling the + test lead the red one as they usually are that color.
Whichever of the two yellow wires you have the red probe on when the meter goes the right direction (or says + xx.x volts) will be the positive one.
If the meter tries to go backward, (or says - xx.x volts) you do not have the red probe on the most positive of the two wires.


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## Scary Papa

okey dokey...got it. I will report back on the results


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## Scary Papa

BobbyA, I got sidetracked and was not able to get to this project. I did however check the continuity between the relay pins 3 & 4. Or at least I tried. I'm not sure if it is operator error, a bad meter (new however) or the relay not working but there was no change in the reading on the meter when the LED triggered. It started with a reading of "1" and it did not move. The reading did go to "0" when I just touched the (+) lead and ground (-) together. I don't have a continuity setting on this meter but I think the resistance setting would work right? I checked again to see if jumping from the (+) lead in the driveway alert receiver battery compartment directly to the relay pin 1 would trigger harry and it did so I have to think the relay is working...maybe not...I don't know. Anyway that is all I was able to get done this evening. I will add the capacitor tomorrow and see if there is any joy after that. I was able to determine which wire is the (+) lead to Harry's try me button at least.


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## BobbyA

Hi Scary, Sounds like progress. Yes the resistance setting can usually be used as a continuity test.
There is a very good chance the LED flash and hence closing of the contacts between pins 3 & 4 would take place in less time than your meter requires to respond.
It's not important to do this, but your meter might have a better chance to "jump" a little if connected between pins 2 & 3, when the relay energizes that connection goes open as pin 3 moves to now connect with pin 4. If we suspect the relay is not operating we can address how to cycle it for longer to test. Just to be clear, there is no LED where you have the relay connected to an LEDs leads ? Only the leds nearby are intact correct ?


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## Scary Papa

Back at ya BobbyA, In answer to your question there is no LED connected to the LED leads where I have the relay connected. I have it connected to the leads on the left. The center LED lead also has only the leads and no light as I thought when it didn't work the first time I might have fried the connection to the board so I did another lead. The LED lead on the right still has a light on it so I can tell when the PIR is triggering the receiver.

I just came in from hooking up the 10uf capacitor. I have to admit I am a little fuzzy on just how to hook up the circuit from the receiver. Here is a photo of how I connected it. Is this close? The capacitor didn't have any designation as to (+) or (-) but it did have one lead longer than the other so I guessed this was important. I assumed it was the (+) lead. Anyway...it didn't trigger the prop with the PIR. I didn't hoook up the larger capacitors as I wanted to be sure the circuit was correct before going any further. Is it possible that the relay is not working even thought when I jump from the (+) in the battery compartment to pin 1 on the relay the prop operates? Also, during one of my earlier tests I did hear a faint click when I jumped to pin 1 with the relay not connected to the prop.


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## BobbyA

Yes that is the way it should be connected. 
Good to know the prop triggered when you connected + from the battery to pin 1 of the relay. That also says the relay is working.
On caps with both leads coming out the same end, the longer is usually positive or +. There is often also a stripe down the length of one side (sometimes with little minuses on it) which also shows the negative lead. 
On axial caps that have 1 leads on each end, there is usually a crimp ring just back from one end that indicate the positive lead.

When you went looking for the most positive lead on the try me circuit, did you happen to notice what the voltage measured between the try me wires was ?


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## Scary Papa

well BobbyA, there is no joy in Mudville tonight. Just came in from working on Harry some more. I tried all of the capacitors I bought...10uf, 22uf, 37uf, and 47 uf ( this is what radio shack had that was closest to what you suggested). Nothing worked. Harry would trigger as soon as I connected the wires to him but would not trigger with the receiver. However, I did notice that the remaining LED light in the receiver is very weak when the PIR triggers it. In fact it eventually did not light up at all. I thought it might be weak batteries so I put the batteries in another receiver and the 3 LED's lit up brightly. So....I am thinking something is going on within the circuit board of the receiver and there is no power or very low power getting to the relay. It still works when I jump from the (+) battery connection at the battery compartment to pin 1 on the relay. Should I try this all over again with a new receiver and new relay? I bought a few extra driveway alerts. Maybe this time leave the chime connected until I get the relay working so I can not only see the LEDs light up but hear the chime as well when the PIR triggers to be sure everything is getting power?


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## CDW

Back EMF from the coil could be damaging the circuit and/or LED; try switching to a new alert, but this time solder a diode (regular, not light emitting) facing backwards (silver line to +) across the coil pins of the relay.


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## CDW

Hey, it just occurred to me - did you ever use a multimeter to find out what voltage those LED lines are putting out? Your relay is rated to trigger at 4.5V, and an LED driver line may be putting out less than that, which would result in intermittent behavior.


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## BobbyA

@CDW with a coil resistance of almost 200 ohms, a current of 23 ma at 4.5V, I would be surprised if the back EMF would cause much of a problem for an led drive circuit.
But a diode shouldn't hurt if Scary has one on hand.

@Scary: Okay so the cap(s) did not help us. 
Next we can try lowering the impedance of the circuit. Scary which led are you connected to ? Let me know which one.
I'll see if there is a current limiting resistor on the led drive, and we can bridge it out of the circuit to see if the relay will switch better. 
There should be a click or two from the relay when the receiver's led flashes (I'm recalling that it flashes a couple times.).
If you have went to a new receiver with the chime connected you probably won't be able to hear the relay, it's very small and quiet anyway.


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## BobbyA

Hey Scary, 
I have the hardware here to take a look at this problem, minus Harry. But I think I can have someone stand in for him.
Take a couple days off this task and let me get back to you with some more useful information.


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## CDW

BobbyA said:


> @CDW with a coil resistance of almost 200 ohms, a current of 23 ma at 4.5V, I would be surprised if the back EMF would cause much of a problem for an led drive circuit.
> But a diode shouldn't hurt if Scary has one on hand.


Fair enough, I just couldn't think of what else could be causing the LED to dim out like that, and it seemed like better safe than sorry. If you've got the necessary to test it all out yourself, that should make troubleshooting a lot easier.


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## Scary Papa

CDW, thank you for your input. I can use all the help I can get with this thing. I have a multimeter but (1) I didn't check the output from the LEDs and (2) I don't actually know how to really use it anyway. And (3) I don't have a diode but I can get one. What is it?

BobbyA, I at first connected to the middle LED of the receiver. When that didn't work with the relay I thought maybe I burned out the LED connection with my poor soldering so I abandoned that LED and went to the one on the left. The LED on the right still has the light attached. I do remember hearing a quite "click" when I first tried this relay. The relay was not triggering Harry so I jumped from the (+) connection in the battery compartment to pin 1 of the relay and pin 3 & 4 were not connected to Harry or anything else. But there was a little click from the relay each time I touched the jumper wire to pin 1 of the relay. I have not yet opened a new receiver as I was waiting to see if this was a good idea or not. As you suggested I will be happy to take a break from this for a couple of days as this infernal electronics stuff is making my brain hurt. If you want I will be happy to mail you an alert and relay and anything else you need to figure this out. (remember my motto?) My wife is getting way too much fun out of this. This is no longer a mission for me....it has now become a quest. And a quest must be completed. And if I don't get this darn thing working my wife will tell all our friends and family this whole story. She has been putting local college catalogs out for me ( we have 5 here) with electronics classes underlined. She is so MEAN..


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## BobbyA

Hi Scary,
Don't open another alert yet. We will figure out what shape the first one is in a bit later. BTW, the little click is all you should ever hear from the relay. 
I have an alert and a relay, so you don't need to send those, but thanks for the offer.

A little about how relays work. 
There is a tiny man inside, and in our case the alert LED voltage coming in on pins 1 & 8 is wired to his chair.
When the alert sends voltage to his chair, he jumps up. Remember this relay is longer than it is tall.
On the ceiling is a switch, when the voltage makes him stand up the click you hear is his head banging into this switch. 
This also happens to close the switch.
It all stays like this until the alert's LED voltage goes away and he can again sit down.

I did some checking on the hardware here.
I won't dump measurements on you, but the led is only on for 1/4 of a second, and the led voltage at the leds is not high enough to reliably operate the relay. 
So now to make it better.


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## CreepyCreations

Scary, sounds like you've got quite the mission on your hands now!


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## Scary Papa

CreepyCreations, OMG..you can't imagine how much fun my wife is getting out of this. I have to succeed or I will NEVER hear the end of it. She really is a Wicked Grandma!

Now BobbyA, left me first tell you that my wife thinks the "technical" information you provided on how the relay works is something that even I might be able to understand.  She laughed so hard she spilled her coffee this morning. Secondly I have to say...ok I couldn't lay off for a couple of days so this morning I went back out just to see if the relay was still "clicking".. It isn't. Also, I thought maybe the prop elves might have come during the night and fixed this problem...They didn't. I again jumped from the (+) connection in the battery compartment to pin 1 with the relay connected to Harry and he triggered. Then I again jumped from the (+) connection in the battery compartment to pin 1 with the pins 3 & 4 not connected to anything to see if I could hear the relay "click" as I have before. Today I did not year the relay click like I have before. Oc course my wife says I couldn't hear it even if it was stuck in my ear. But I think she is exaggerating. I then checked again as to how to make Harry trigger by touching the wires from his try me button together. He will trigger with really not much connection time. With nothing connected to him and his try me function turned on I can make him trigger just by striking the wires together as if striking a match....which is precisely what I may end up doing to him if I can't get this operational. Anyway...now I will not go back out there for a couple of days.


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## BobbyA

Hi Scary, Happy to hear she was amused. Sorry about the coffee. I nearly killed a friend one time on a road trip, said something funny and he choked on his yahoo. 
Could not get his breath back. I thought, oh carp how an I going to tell his mother he died on the trip, and who is ever going to believe how it happened...

Ah something occurs to me, is the relay still wired to the led pins when you connect the + from the battery to the relay to test Harry ?


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## Scary Papa

Yeah BobbyA, it was a real laugh fest around the coffee pot here this morning. To answer you question...yes the relay is still hooked up to the LED leads. I just touch the jumper wire to pin1 and Harry triggers. I touch the jumper to pin 3 on the relay to see if it clicks with the wires connected to pin 3 & 4 not connected to Harry.


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## BobbyA

Okay a couple things worth mentioning.
Touching the + battery voltage wire to pins 3 or 4 shouldn't do anything, which is what you saw.
Touching the + battery voltage wire to pin 1 should make the relay close the switch at pins 3 & 4, which should trigger Harry if it is connected.

However touching the + battery voltage wire to pin 1 of the relay while the LED is still connected to the relay can a little hard on the either the LEDs, or the chip driving the LEDs, or both. Which may explain why the leds seem to be fading. Probably should disconnect the relay (you only need to isolate pin 1 and it can be done from the led end if you prefer) from the led when you want to do that test. 
We can look into it's condition a bit later when we get ready to use the alert again.


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## Scary Papa

Ok BobbyA, Just to be clear the LED light is not connected to the LED leads where the relay is connected. The only LED light still connected to its leads is the one on the far right. The middle LED light and the one on the left where the relay is connected I cut off the LED light. The relay was never connected to any LED leads where the light was still conntected. Hope this helps.


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## hauntedtig

I used this idea last year and it worked great!
One little thing you might want to try: We were worried people would hear the chime noise (which is pretty loud even on low), so I cut the grill over the speaker and packed extra bits of felt into the hole to stifle the noise as much as possible. You could still hear the chime before the prop kicked in, but it was much less noticeable.


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## Scary Papa

hauntedtig, Yeah as I said there is a little noise with this setup but it is very quick, easy and cheap. I found that with the sounds and other distractions in the Haunted Forest it really wasn't noticible at all. As you said, a little sound dampening around the receiver helps too. However, this year I am going a little more "high tech" and modifying the driveway alert using information that BobbyA has posted here. I have been very happy with the results so far. The resistor in the speaker wire from the receiver really works good. I am now trying to get the relay modification working to use with my props that have a try me button.


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## Ethereal

Ok I think I read the entire thread and you guys definitely lost me along the way. I am only able to understand the basics of "buy driveway motion sensors with different channel numbers" and thats it. I don't want to fall down the rabbit hole by trying to rewire them. Does anyone know if I can pick these up at a menards or home depot? I don't have a Harbor Freight. Scary Papa, in your experience, did these work when its dark? Thanks!


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## Scary Papa

Ethereal, I use these driveway alerts outside, in the dark in the haunted Forest and they have worked great. I think it's because they are passive infra red and therefore can "see" in the dark. Unlike the motion detectors used in my props that rely on someone walking in front of a light to trigger. Anyway, that's what I have experienced. As far as rewiring the driveway alert you really don't have to "rewire" the receiver. If you follow BobbybA's excellent instructions you can simply remove the chime speaker from the housing using a heat gun to soften the glue then cut the speaker wires and solder new wires to the speaker wires to extend the speaker. Then put a resistor in line in one of the speaker wires and close up the case. Then place the receiver speaker as close as possible to the sound sensor in your prop. This will eliminate any noise from the speaker at all. I have done this with several alerts and believe me if I can do it anyone can. I don't know if Menards has these as we don't have this store here. I have not seen the cheap driveway alerts at Home Depot but they may have them or something similar. Good luck


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## BobbyA

You might consider, next time a cheap coupon (or sign up for them) comes out. 
Buy the alerts online from Harbor Freight and have them shipped to you.


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## Ethereal

BobbyA said:


> You might consider, next time a cheap coupon (or sign up for them) comes out.
> Buy the alerts online from Harbor Freight and have them shipped to you.


I thought about that. I saw them on amazon.com too but if I order them online, I'm not sure I can request them all with different channels. I will first try to find them in a store I think.


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## BobbyA

*Try me button interface circuit for the alert box.*

Here is a schematic for the technical folks to buffer and stretch the led flash and trigger a prop thought it's TRY ME button connector.
This closes the switch (relay) for 3+ seconds each time the alert is triggered by the remote PIR. 
Scary, your's is in the mail.


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## Scary Papa

BobbyA, thank you so much. I printed off the technical sketch. Of course I have no idea what I am looking at. But when my friends and family are so amazed and want to know how this works I can whip this sketch out and they will think I am a genius. Seriously, I will tell them that it could not have been possible without the most excellent help of BobbyA.


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## Scary Papa

Hi BobbyA, you are a genius. The package arrived yesterday and I immediately went to the dungen to connect everything up. It worked perfecty! We are doing the happy dance here in the Haunted Forest. I can't tell you how much I appreciate all the work you did on this for me. I am sending a PM. Thanks again.


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## BobbyA

Hi Scary, Glad to hear it finally arrived and you're up and running.
My regular computer had a stroke and expired, I have another on the way and will resume doodling with the board then.
In the meantime I'd be happy to help you understand what the diagram is about. 

Let's start on the lower left, the wire from the alert's LED goes to a diode (D1) that only allows the voltage to come in, but not go back when the LED goes out.
The 220uf capacitor charges up while that voltage is on, and slowly discharges by the 5.6K resistor draining it to ground. We don't the relay to stay on too long. 
The 74LS14 is a chip that is easier to turn on than the relay, and stays on even when the voltage in the capacitor starts getting lower than the relay can use.
But it inverts the the LED voltage, When the LED is on, the output of this gate is off, so the 2nd one flips it back. LED on = 2nd 74LS14 output also on.
To work the relay we add some muscle to the chip, that is what the 2N3904 transistor is doing, turning on the relay by connecting it's ground wire when needed.
The 2.2K resistor is making sure we don't turn the transistor on too hard and break it. 
You already know how the relay is used as a switch to close Harry's try me button wires.


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## Scary Papa

Whoo Hoo BobbyA, why didn't you say so in the first place? Now of course I totally understand that technical stuff. LOL. Really, I am still confused as to what is really happening. Enough to just say it works and I am going to try to make one for myself and I am going to study that diagram and figure it out with this info you provided and draw me a little picture with PIRs, capacitors, LED's , diodes, resistors, and those little 74LS14's all in their proper place even if it kills me. I know with all the help you have had to give me you probably think I am a total moron. But I do have 3 college degrees and I still cannot figure this stuff out. But I am well on my way to getting it. Of course my wife says I will understand this "when pigs fly". So you should still keep my motto in the back of your mind...never do anything for yourself that you can get.....oh never mind. Please remember to send the info I asked for in the PM.


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## BobbyA

Short answer is the little board catches the sub-second alert LED voltage, and stretches it out to 3 seconds while operating the relay with it.

Parts list minus wiring or connector is: BTW these are "through hole" parts don't buy surface mount parts. 

1 diode Part # 1N914 or 1N4148
1 capacitor 220uF 6Vdc or 10Vdc (higher Vdc can be used but you don't need it)
1 capacitor 0.01uF (any VDC you can find should work) 
1 IC 74LS14 in 14 pin DIP package.
1 resistor 5.6K 1/10W (1/8W or 1/4W is okay to use instead)
1 resistor 2.2K 1/10W ( " )
1 transistor 2N3904 ( 2N2222 is okay to use instead )
1 relay Omron G6K-2F-Y 

I'll get you a copy of a wiring diagram.


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## Scary Papa

Thanks BobbyA. I'm going to get these parts and try it. Once I get the parts I may be able to figure out how to put it together by looking at the original. All kidding aside I have really learned at lot from you during this project.


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## HarleyQuinn07

BobbyA and Scary Papa... First, I'd like to say that I thoroughly really really enjoyed reading this thread! I got a kick out of it and have to admit I would have responded to most of BobbyA's posts by saying "huh?"!  Awesome!

The idea is so intriguing! I've been troubled and thinking about the best way to trigger my sound activated props (that practically require a tap/nudge). Last year, I found myself talking and tapping on my props to activate them myself! :/

I'm am however confused about the "rigging" that BobbyA is referring to. Is the rigging meant to kill the driveway alert sound (i.e. ding-dong) and force a "current" of some sort to trigger the prop without requiring the sound? In other words, we are talking about using a motion detector (such as a driveway alert system) to set off a sound activated prop (by placing driveway alert bell next to prop sound input speaker) -- but then bypassing the sound and somehow automatically triggering the prop to go off as if someone pressed the "try me" button. Am I following this correctly?? I'd like to do this but want to understand IF you are only doing this extra rigging step to eliminate the sound ("ding-dong") that activates the prop. If so, is it because the bell is annoying, too loud or impeding the prop scare / authenticity effects? I just want to make sure I'm following and I don't know anything about electrical stuff, receivers, wires, etc. ----- Or, was this extra rigging to prevent the need to buy multiple driveway alert systems on different channels??? -----

Now, for the actual devices: If I have 6 sound activated props in my yard that I'd like to transform into motion activated props (each triggered independently), should I buy 6 driveway alert systems / motion sensors that are each on a different channel?

If I was ok with having 2 props be activated at the same time - like a jumping speeder (quick) and a story telling prop (longer), I could buy 2 driveway alert systems on the same channel so they will both go off when either one of the units are triggered. So the only difference in same time or independently is NOT the addition of more units... it's the addition of units on different channels?

Thanks in advance! I really appreciate your insight! 

HarleyQuinn07


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## BobbyA

Hi Harley,
Glad we could inform and amuse. To answer your question, hopefully...
Harbor Freight driveway alerts have a Passive InfraRed detector unit that sends a wireless radio signal to the receiver unit when something moves in the detectors field of view.
That signal will cause the receiver unit to flash it's 3 red LEDs a couple times, and make an annoying chime sound from a little pizeo speaker.
The PIR transmitter uses a 9V battery, and the receiver uses 3 C-cell batteries, or a (not included) 6V wall transformer. Different radio channel receivers can be used in the same area without all being set off by a single PIR, or multiple receivers on a same channel can be used to set off multiple props at the same time. Or some combination of the two options can be mixed.

You can set the receiver near a prop's sound sensor and trigger the prop.
You can also remove the alert's speaker and place just the speaker near the prop sound sensor providing you extend the speaker wire length.
You can lower the volume of the speaker with padding or tape, or you can cut one of the speaker wires and splice in a resistor (see earlier in thread for values).
You might be able to connect the speaker wires, (w/ resistor) directly to the wires for the prop's sound sensor, but this may not be easy to accomplish.
Using the circuit board in the diagram, connected inside the alert, you can trigger a prop using it's "try me" button connector. In this case the speaker and the prop's sound sensor are not needed or used. 

In your case a real prop controller might also prove useful along with alerts. It can also be triggered by an alert but play sound tracks, trigger more than one prop at intervals you need, etc. Have a look at the 4-button learning controller in For Sale by merchants section of the forum.


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## Scary Papa

HarleyQuinn07, yeah what BobbyA said. I certainly don't know much about this. Only what BobbyA has been able to help me with. But I do know that if you follow BobbA's excellent information on this threat and remove the speaker from the driveway alert and extend its wiring to be long enough to reach the sound sensor in your prop and then put a resistor in one of the speaker wire lines it will activate your prop through the PIR of the driveway alert and essentially make it a motion sensor activated prop. The speaker is easily removed from the driveway alert receiver case by using a heat gut and gently moving it over the speaker until the glue holding it softens. Don't use too much heat or you will melt the case...not that I have actually done that....well maybe just once. After removing the speaker and soldering wires to extend the speaker from the case I hot glue the driveway alert speaker directly over the sound sensor on my props. Because the prop sound sensors were all in a plastic case that I couldn't get into I wasn't able to wire the alert receiver speaker wires directly to the props sound sensor wires. Now when these driveway alerts activate you cannot hear anything from the speakers but they still activate the sound sensor of the prop. Although for a cheap and quick prop trigger placing he driveway alert receiver with no modification next to the sensor of your prop will work quite well and will trigger the prop there still will be a little sound from the alert speaker even on the low volume setting. Putting some sound dampening material around the receiver or placing the prop further from the viewers will also help. But BobbyA's fix for this is super and really does not take vary long to accomplish. I have used it on 5 of my sound activated props right now and I am going to put it on 2 more before Halloween. They all work great. Believe me when I say if I can do it anyone can. If you are going to activate more than one prop you will need more than one driveway alert unless you don't mind having all of your props on the alerts activate at the same time. This was a problem I ran into until BobbyA, pointed out that these driveway alerts can be purchased on different channels. I have not yet graduated to a prop controller but as soon as I get the hang of making the relay board that BobbyA has been helping me with I am going to try one of those prop controller gadgets. That is if BobbyA doesn't abandon me and move to a commune in Montana to get away from me.


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## BobbyA

Scary had another good idea, certainly worth passing along here. 
Cut off one of the three red LEDs in the alert, about halfway down it's leads. Splice in two wires at the cut point, make them long enough that LED can be placed over the light sensor of your prop. You can then put a piece of dark tape over the led to hold it in place and hide the light from the TOTs.

Now you have a way to use a wireless PIR motion sensor to activate your prop by it's Try Me port, sound sensor, or light sensor.


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## ptbounce

Test fired my Bone Collector on the driveway motion detector. Works like a champ!

Have to try it on Ghost Girl next


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## CreepyCreations

I like the idea of using the scare's motion detector feature and the LED from the sensor as a trigger. Simple, and you don't have to modify the scare at all! Great idea!


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## Scary Papa

BobbyA, thanks for posting this information. I have just been busy trying to get everything ready for Halloween and I just didn't get around to it. Yep I was just fooling around with the driveway alert again and I found that if you cut one of the LEDs and extend the LED by adding wiring long enough for it to reach the motion senson of the prop it would fire the prop even in darkness. By putting the LED over the motion sensor and then keeping it in place with a piece of black tape it will hide the red LED so you don't see it when it flashes. You can also put black tape over the window of the driveway alert receiver to hide the remaining LED lights. While you have the driveway alert open you should also cut the wires leading to the speaker so the speaker will not chime when the alert fires. For a quick and very easy trigger for a motion sensor activated prop with the motion sensor located at the base of the prop you can just lay the driveway alert over the motion sensor with the driveway alert's LED lights in front of the prop's motion sensor. It will trigger the prop when the receiver is triggered by the PIR. Again, you should really cut the wires to the driveway alert's speaker so it will not chime when the alert triggers. Also, you should lay something over the driveway alert to camo it so it is not noticeable. I paint mine flat black but be sure to not paint the window of the PIR sending unit or the window over the red LED lights.


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## ptbounce

Sooooooo, Mr Bone Collector worked as well as he's going to. Got at 75% off at Spirit last year (returned from another customer)

Tried the motion detecor on Ghost Girl and ran into problems with the sound.

Damn Spirit Halloween


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## hauntedtig

I stumbled on a simple hack that worked without a hitch on our haunt night, so I wanted to share it with you all.

We were trying to use the driveway alert system with a standard motion/sound sensing witch prop. We successfully used the sound to trigger her last year, but it quit working right before the party this year. In desperation, I ended up pulling apart the sound/light unit and playing around with the parts.

Here's what I did...
1) Open up the "receiver" sound/light unit thing. Don't forget the two screws "hidden" in the battery compartment.
2) Disconnect the wires leading the speaker (I did this on accident when I lost patience with the hidden screws above).
3) Pull the round, metal sound-sensor disc from it's hot glue perch on the prop.
I pulled mine off on accident and one of the brown wires connected to it came loose, too. I'm not sure if you need to disconnect one of the brown wires. It seemed to work just as well when I held the wire in place, but I ended up leaving it off because it worked without it, too.
4) Run the wire so that the metal disc ends up between two of the red LED lights. It didn't seem to matter if it was face up or down.
5) Close up the receiving unit with the disc inside. I carved a little notch in the case so it could close up without pinching the wire.
6) The wire should be long enough to attach the receiving unit to the prop without pulling on the wire. I just taped my to the witch near her head, and it was totally hidden by her cloak.

That's it! I can't promise it will work for you (since I don't know WHY it's working), so USE AT YOUR OWN RISK!
But it sure did the trick for me without any soldering or buying new parts!

Here's a LINK to some reference photos and additional notes.


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## BobbyA

@hauntedtig I don't recommend your method. lol 
I suspect it's still working because the outer ring of the speaker disk was connected to the wire you pulled off.
The other end of that wire probably went to the same place this lead of the LEDs goes, so as long as the disk contacts the red leds lead the speaker will keep working. Just a guess.


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## Col. Fryght

First off-Scary and BobbyA, you guys are both amazing. Scary your tenacity is really something and BobbyA your patience in trying to explain things is fantastic. I spent Halloween flashing some of my props with a flash light as people walked by in order to get them to work.

I see a different future for me next year. The led extension trick and the speaker over lay trick are probably in my wheel house. BobbyA, if you ever want to make a few of the try me board connections, I would be happy to pay you for the conversion. 


You guys deserve some sort of forum medal for a job well done.


Brian


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## Scary Papa

Col. Fryght,I definitely agree that BobbyA deserves a magnificient award for patience and also for being a genius. I, on the other hand, am only a "pawn in the game of life" to qoite Mongo in Balzing Saddles. Actually, these cheap driveway alerts, while not really sofisticated, do work really well for a quick and easy prop trigger. Especially when you use the wonderful modification provided by BobbyA. His modification is really easy to do and actually only takes about 30 minutes. If you can get to the wiring for the sound sensor of your prop you can eliminate the driveway alert speaker completely and therefore have no sound at all coming from the driveway alert. But if like some of my props you can't actually get inside the plastic case to access the prop sound sensor wiring you can just extend the speaker from the driveway alert and place it directly on top of the sound sensor of the prop. The resistor reduces something (BobbyA told me but I don't remember what) to the point that there is virtually no sound from the speaker but it will still activate the sound sensor of the prop. Even if you can wire the driveway alert directly to the sound sensor wiring of your prop you still need to use the resistor to eliminate the chance of damaging your prop from the current from the driveway alert.


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## Col. Fryght

I think I am first going to try using one of the LED lights from the driveway alert receiver to activate the motion/light sensor on props without a "try me" connection. That should really work well on some of my Grandin Road props. If I understand correctly this should be a really, really, simple hack.

1. I can just nip one of the LED lights off the receiver.
2. Solder an extension wire to the LED terminal.
3. Cut the extension wire to the desired length.
4. Solder the LED light onto the end of the wire.
5. Then place the receiver under the prop clothing, run the wire to the sensor
and tape the LED to the sensor using a small piece of tape matching the prop.

I guess my only question is what type of extension wire would work best?


Brian
PS. Driveway Alerts at Freight Harbor are on sale now for $17.99 (Normally 24.99). But you can download a 30% off coupon, but it is only good for one item.


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## BobbyA

That is basically correct. There are a couple of details, you need two wires, and need to keep the same led lead going to the same side wire. 
If you get the wires crossed the led won't work. Tip: cut the led leads to different lengths, that way you can always go back and check.
It really carries a tiny amount of current, so almost any wire will do. You can cut up one of those now nearly useless phone handset to wall cords. lol


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## Scary Papa

Yeah, what BobbyA said. You know I am really not very smart about these things but I would sugest this: If your prop has a motion sensor that is at the base of the prop you can run a test to see if the driveway alert will trigger the prop by simply laying the receiver face down on top of the prop's motion sensor with the receiver LED light over the motion sensor "eye". Trigger the alert and the prop should activate. If it does then you know you can do the simple hack on the driveway alert with a high degree of confidence your prop will trigger with the alert once you extend the LED light. Actually you could use this and not even have to extend the wiring of the receiver LED light. You could just cover the receiver at the base of the prop with some type of camo material. I did this this year on my singing skeleton prop because of running out of time and I just put a small cardboard box over the receiver. I painted the box black. On the wire size issue on the modifications I made I used the smallest stranded wire that I had which was about 22 gauge. If you follow BobbyA's instructions you will not have any problems at all.


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## Col. Fryght

Okay, my journey to follow the trail blazed by Scary Papa and BobbyA has begun in earnest. I know zip about electronics other than how to install a light fixture. And with most things that I am clueless about, I basically have to have a Missouri approach- "show me." So to that end I will be posting pics as I go along to help me and others. I think this project is important to all haunters who want to make some great store bought props work as well outside at night as they do in the home under perfect conditions.

Here is a pic of the three units that I bought from Freight Harbor. They only had three separate channels available- 18,19, and 20. And as previously mentioned the channel sticker is placed above the UPC code.

Just for my knowledge, not that it overly matters towards the project, are these channels specific to this manufacturer or are they standardized like radio and TV channels?


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## Screaming Demons

Harbor Freight is going to have their driveway alerts on sale for just $9.99 each on Nov. 29 and 30 and Dec. 1.


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## BobbyA

That's a dollar more than last year, but I'm in for a couple.


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## Screaming Demons

At my local store they've been 13.99 and up for a long time.


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## BobbyA

Yeah they will shovel them out for Black Friday sale to the sidewalk in front of store, at least that is what they did last year. Those were $8.99 ea.
I had posted a coupon earlier in this thread, that you could print and use for $10.99 ea. But it's expired now.


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## Col. Fryght

Any chance anybody want to help me find two more other than channels 18,19 and 20? I have converted those three, but I would like two more. These things are a real game changer.


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## Scary Papa

Col. Fryght, I don't mind trying to find some with different channels here for you but with shipping to you it might not be a very good value. Hey...I just thought of another possibility. I have had the local Harbor Freight store ship things to the local store from another another store for me. You might try asking them to ship a couple of driveway alerts from another store to yours with different channels. Just a thought.


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## Col. Fryght

Scary Papa said:


> Col. Fryght, I don't mind trying to find some with different channels here for you but with shipping to you it might not be a very good value. Hey...I just thought of another possibility. I have had the local Harbor Freight store ship things to the local store from another another store for me. You might try asking them to ship a couple of driveway alerts from another store to yours with different channels. Just a thought.


That is a good thought.


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## BobbyA

Maybe I can again offer a little help. Why not buy what you can find, and change the channels to what you need.
The units use jumpers to set the channels, appearing to be a binary system.
I took my ch16 receiver changed the jumper by removing the solder bridge at A1 and it then worked with my ch14 transmitter.
The pictures below should help. They show a channel 14 transmitter, channel 14 receiver, and a channel 16 receiver.
For the receivers, jumper A0 is the LSB or the 1, A3 is MSB. For channel 14 jumper A1 is not connected, J2 is not connected on the transmitter.
Soldering J2 back together on the transmitter would change it to work on channel 16. If J3 is only connected jumper the transmitter would be on channel 5 (mfg adds 1 more to the binary jumper value, so 4 becomes channel 5)
So channel 14 it is jumpered A0 + A2 + A3 and channel 16 is A0+A1+A2+A3.
Channel number doesn't really matter as long the transmitter and receiver have the same jumper pattern. If you put two (or more) receivers on the same channel pattern then both will activate when a single transmitter is tripped. 
I don't have any alerts with channels higher than 16, so I don't know what they did for 20, maybe a slightly different board.
As always please feel free to ask if you have questions.


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## Col. Fryght

I know your speaking English BobbyA, but you lost me at binary system.  It reminds of that movie where Brad Pitt played an irish mafia tough guy. He spoke English, but I did not understand a darn thing he said during the entire movie.


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## BobbyA

You can google binary number system, and even find good tutorials.
But here is a short course. We write the number for two hundred thirty one as (decimal) 231. What that means is, in our number there is:
2 in the hundreds place or has two 100s in it.
3 in the tens place
1 in the ones place or
200
30
1
add them up and you get 231 or the number for two hundred thirty one.

In binary a number like our normal 231 looks like this, 11100111 and reads like this:
1 in the 128s place
1 in the 64s place
1 in the 32s place
0 in the 16s place (so don't add 16)
0 in the 8s place (so don't add 8)
1 in the 4s place
1 in the 2s place 
1 in the 1s place. (notice how each number is half or double the number in the next place, depending which way you are going.)
So we have:
128
64
32
4
2
1 which when all added up can also be written as 231 in decimal (our normal 0-9 number system).

Computer chips pretty much work by having a voltage at their pins or not So instead of trying to yell 7 at a chip we give it a lot of pins and let them represent the numbers in the binary system in which a 1 is represented by a voltage on the pin, and a zero (or no 1) by no voltage going to the pin. So if you place a 
a jumper wire connecting the chip's pin to a voltage, the chip will read it as a 1 on that pin. Hence 1101 could be read by the chip's 4 pins as:
1 in the 8s place, (Jumper A3 in the above middle picture)
1 in the 4s place, (Jumper A2 in the above middle picture)
0 in the 2s place, ( Opened jumper A1 in the above middle picture)
1 in the 1s place. (Jumper A0 in the above middle picture)
Add these up and you get decimal 13. 
Before you say WTF how is that channel 14. Recall that 0000 (instead of 1101) or no jumpers installed could also be a valid number "zero".
But instead of calling it channel 0 they just called this channel 1, and moved all the others up by one number.


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## Col. Fryght

I just wanted to finish my journey into creating the LED extension using the driveway alerts. There are a lot of great commercial animated props (especially at 50%off) that look great but they don't work well outdoors. An example of this is my animated scarecrow from Grandin Road which I scored for $45. Outside on Halloween, it occasionally activated, but I found myself shining a flashlight on it to get it to work. Here is a catalog picture of the prop and the light sensor tube which is located in the chest:


















Keep in mind that I solder like an 8 year old, so if I can do it then anyone can. The goal is to extend one of LED's in order to tape it over the light sensor of the prop. That way when the wireless driveway alert is activated the prop will go off. You will need a tiny eyeglass type screwdriver to take the receiver apart. But before taking it apart, I put batteries in the both the sending and receiving unit to make sure that they worked before I started to monkey around with it. 

Once apart you want to clip off one of the LED lights, As BobbyA mentioned suggested, I cut the LED legs at an angle with a pair of scissors. You have to wire the same leg on the board to the same leg on the LED. The great thing is if you wire it backwards, no big deal. You don't blow anything up, and the other LED's still work. So if you do butcher something, then you still have two more LED's to practice on. Almost any wire will do for the extension, I robbed some wire off an adapter for one of my alerts. I just cut it at both ends and split it down the middle into its two wire sections.










I solder one wire at a time. Since you cut the LED legs at an angle, simply solder the extension wire to the short leg on the board to the long leg on the LED. And then solder the other wire to the remaining leg on the board and the leg on the LED. As I mentioned before, I solder like an eight year old. 

I simply strip off the end of the wire exposing some bare wire, wrap into a small circle or lasso and place over the LED leg and drop a bead of solder on it. This probably makes professionals cringe but it works for me . When I am finished, I put the batteries back in and test the LED. 

Once it is confirmed working, I then cut one of the speaker wires near the solder joint since I do not need the sound to operate the prop. And then I put the cover back on. I put the receiving unit inside the scarecrow and fed the LED extension wire through the shirt and taped it onto the light sensor with tape. The LED activated the scarecrow every single time when activated and I now have a wireless trigger that can be placed hundreds of feet away. Here are pics of the final product:





























Hopefully this journey by a true electronics dummy will encourage others to try this. Since it is just me and wife doing our haunt, I really need to make things as automated as possible and this trick really bails me out on that front and on motion/light activated the props I bought that never seemed to work as well outdoors as they did indoors.


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## BobbyA

Nice work Col. 

When you say drop a bead of solder, I am hoping you use the iron to heat the junction of the two wires to be connected, and then touch the solder wire to the junction to melt. That will help avoid "cold solder joints" which are a bit like wrapping tin foil around the junction, which can sometimes lead to reliability issues later. 
You can dangle a blob of solder off the end of the iron and touch that to the junction, but it sometimes results in the same problem. Touching the solder to the junction gives the flux in the center of the solder a chance to clean the oxides and such from your wires, and lets the solder flow properly over their surface.


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## Col. Fryght

BobbyA said:


> Nice work Col.
> 
> When you say drop a bead of solder, I am hoping you use the iron to heat the junction of the two wires to be connected, and then touch the solder wire to the junction to melt. That will help avoid "cold solder joints" which are a bit like wrapping tin foil around the junction, which can sometimes lead to reliability issues later.
> You can dangle a blob of solder off the end of the iron and touch that to the junction, but it sometimes results in the same problem. Touching the solder to the junction gives the flux in the center of the solder a chance to clean the oxides and such from your wires, and lets the solder flow properly over their surface.


It goes without saying do as Bobby says. I was just trying to demonstrate the basic level of the project by someone with a limited skill set. At least I know that if my lights don't work next year, that a redo of my soldering joints will probably be in order. 

.


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## DaveintheGrave

Those are great pics and a nice tutorial, Col. Fryght. I've been interested in this thread all season and I think I might pick up a couple of these driveway sensors when they go on sale.

Thanks to BobbyA and Scary Papa for all of their information, too.


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## Scary Papa

Col. Fryght...very nice job on your project.


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## BobbyA

These driveway alerts are $9.99 at HF this weekend. Had to go inside the store to find the boxes with channels listed on the outside.


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## Ghost of Spookie

Read thru this thread for the first time. Turns out I picked up two of the Bunker Hill driveway alarms last fall from Harbor Freight that are the same channel, Channel 19. The channel designation was labeled on my boxes above the Bar Code as mentioned. Never would have given "CH 19" any second thought. I probably would have guessed that it was "CHecked by inspector 19!" Glad Col. Fryght posted a link to this thread or I probably would have realized the channel issue on mine too late to plan to do anything about it...or simply been in the dark with everything going off at the same time come Halloween.

I think right now Harbor Freight's sale price on the alarms is at $17 something. I know they run coupons in the newspapers which sometimes reduce the prices even further. I find mine in our newspaper in the little insert magazine (maybe USA Weekend or something like that) that arrives during the last weekend of the month (have only found it in this edition). The coupons sometimes last for a few months so you can stock up on them for multiple purchases. I plan to pick up a few more alarm units and this time will be sure to look for the Channel indication. I personally like that you have the option of using battery or adapter with it.

Somewhere in the many pages of discussion here, I think someone mentioned that it's not necessarily a bad thing to have devices with the same channel. Depends on your setup and scare. Having a room full of dead props (like John Doe bodies) that suddenly come to life at one time is great too. 


BTW somewhere on the forum I seem to remember an old thread post I think from Otaku that showed taking a PIR and narrowing it's field of detection. Remember some sort of sleeve was made and used with the PIR that gave it a rather narrow target area. I'm thinking the "scan" field of this device could be similarly modified if need be (although I'm not savvy in this area at all so it's just a guess on my part). Anyone? BTW Otaku has posted a lot of info on the forum about PIR triggers so might be a worth a search for you.


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## BobbyA

Hi GoS, There are a couple ways to limit the field of view. Mostly they are intended to make the PIR on go off when someone is in a specific location.
Placing a piece of PVC pipe over a detector will do it. But these have a window in front that makes reaching the detector difficult. You can use a mask, place a piece of cardboard over the window, a hole in the cardboard of the desired size and shape will limit the PIR to only detecting where it can see.


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## CDW

In my attempts to color the plastic lens black without preventing the sensor from working at all (answer:Sharpie), I learned that electrical tape thoroughly blocks IR, so taping all but a small area would also work.


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## Ghost of Spookie

Great suggestions BobbyA and CDW.

Just got my weekend paper and since it's the end of the month there's a USA Weekend magazine insert, so there's also a Harbor Freight ad in it. There's a 20% off any single item Super Coupon (haven't read restrictions) and the Bunker Hill Security wireless system is now on sale for $13.99. I think this is the lowest price they offer. Believe it says Limit 3 on the coupon. There's also a free Pittsburgh 25 ft measuring tape with coupon with any purchase. These ads in the scaled-down USA Weekend magazine are much smaller than those run on a full size newspaper page. I need a magnifying glass for the small print though! 

Definitely going in for a few more alarms and this time I will be paying attention to the Channel number on the box. If you are reading this and don't know what that sentence means, go back and read the thread. Otherwise you could end up with multiple units and they all trigger at the same time!


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## Screaming Demons

Every time I've ever asked Harbor Freight will only apply the 20-25 percent off coupons to regularly priced merchandise, not sale items.


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## Ghost of Spookie

*Harbor Freight's Bunker Hill Alarm on Sale thru Halloween*


To go with my post above (do read if you haven't), I magnified the super coupon on the Bunker Hill Alert and it's Limit 5 with coupon, says coupon must be presented. One coupon per day. On this coupon it does say can't be used with other discount or coupon or prior purchase after 30 days from original purchase price with original receipt. So guess they will cost match to the sale if you bought it within the past month. That's nice. Good while supply lasts. Valid thru 10/29/14. Should get people thru Halloween then at the &13.99 price.

Screaming Demons you are correct that the Super Coupon for 20% off states that it cannot be used on other discount, coupon, gift cards, inside Club Track membership, extended service plans or a list of other specified items printed on the coupon. Lots of places like Michaels, etc. restrict their larger discount coupon usage but people should be aware you can't use the Super 20% off Coupon on the $13.99 price of the alarm.


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## mikeerdas

Bumping up. This is good stuff!


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## BobbyA

I'll see your bump, and raise you a notice that on Black Friday the price will be $9.99
.


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## mikeerdas

BobbyA said:


> I'll see your bump, and raise you a notice that on Black Friday the price will be $9.99
> .


Nice, thanks!  Is online ordering possible? Or in-store only? I'll be away traveling and so not in driving distance to a Harbor Freight. Shipping would be an added cost, but perhaps I could purchase two to spread out that cost.


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## DaveintheGrave

If you can't find any other option, let me know, Mike. I can run up to my Harbor Freight and pick up some for you. It's about 7 miles from my house.


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## mikeerdas

DaveintheGrave said:


> If you can't find any other option, let me know, Mike. I can run up to my Harbor Freight and pick up some for you. It's about 7 miles from my house.


Thanks Dave! I'll actually be flying home back to RDU Friday afternoon--sometimes I can still grab Black Friday items later in the day. Especially if they're not ones in high demand. Got my very first projector on a Black Friday afternoon / evening--one of the Discovery Wonderwalls for $50. Forget if it was from Kohls or Staples, but it started me out on my rear projection adventures. 

Still use the Wonderwall for playing the Pumpkin Jamboree with my singing pumpkins effect.

Still haven't found a hosting org for the charity haunt, but I'm still working on it. May need to meet with a local SBA SCORE counselor--while they exist to help entrepreneurs launch for profit businesses, they may have connections in the community to help find a Show Building in the Raleigh, NC and also to help with PM skills in organizing the haunt--budgeting, etc.

The Lions Club seems like one potential option open to me. Seems non-partisan and secular, with a community focus. They may have access to some good resources. I'd join the Jaycees but am now in my early 40's and so don't qualify for membership. 

Whether it's 2015 or 2016, I so badly want to establish an annual semi-pro haunt for a good charity as a fundraising event. Will have to get cranking after the holidays and/or during.

Two books are traveling with me to New England on my flights:

* The basic Make Electronics Book
* Making Things Move DIY Mechanisms for Inventors, Hobbyists, and Artists

The second book is really fabulous. It's going to help me hugely in understanding the basics of motors and mechanisms. I'd recommend it to others who are new to animatronics, motors, etc.


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## DaveintheGrave

OK, Mike! I hope you have time to grab a few driveway alerts. I might stop by and pick up one or two myself. Actually, I got a sales flyer in the mail today from Harbor Freight with a coupon good now for something called a "Wireless Security Alert System", but it looks like the Driveway Alarm. Price $13.99 w/coupon.

Those two books sound really good. I though you already built moving props?

This site is very helpful for making moving props: 
http://www.robives.com/mechs

Have a safe trip!


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## namrog

Mike,
FYI, the Harbor Freight flyer says that the prices are good thru Sunday. Check their website.


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## Ghost of Spookie

Headed out in Black Friday traffic to my local HF for the alarms (a bit slow in spots but not that bad). The two I own from before were both # 93068 (both Channel 19). While they still list this as one of the product SKUs for the Black Friday sale price, none of the older boxes were left in my store. What my store had in stock was # 69590, and there were two different box styles for it. One appeared to be an older box with two white devices (bought the last 3 of those) and the other box was larger and thinner and came with a silver alarm device and a white sensor. Neither box design indicated a channel designation, nor did the instructions or devices themself. Don't have the time to open anything up now but if they can't be modified to set a different channel (jumper reconfig), I figure I have 2 of one channel and now 3 of probably another whatever channel that may be. Nice price.

What are you guys finding in your store?


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## DvlsToy

Same at mine, but the lines were ridiculous so I didn't buy them. I'll probably go back this weekend, they had plenty of both boxes.


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## mikeerdas

Thanks Namrog and Dave. @Dave, thanks for the RobIves link. Seen it before but never spent much time there. I love books to pick-up and browse through for reference, underlining, etc. 

Read some of the Making Things Move book during flights--skimmed some of the more technical parts. Decent book. While I've built a few small props that move, I decided it was time to try to learn more about motors, translating motion types, etc. And especially learning about torque--because I've been limited there with various motors I've tried to repurpose--for example, trying to repurpose a battery operated disco ball spinner motor, intended for rotating a hanging object (8" Disco Ball), for the Haunted Mansion shadow hand/claw was interesting. Operating in a different plane, it could barely rotate a small foam board hand cut-out. Also experienced limitations with torque in trying to repurpose an oscillating fan for a pseudo FCG--worked, but just barely...

@Spookie, sorry you're not certain of the channels for the ones you purchased. But like you say, at that price, worth the gamble. I'm sure you'll be able to find a use, even if you can't mod them. Sometimes limiting constraints can lead you to a cool project concept you may not have arrived at if you'd gotten precisely what you think you wanted--if that makes any sense.

Since the online price was $9.99 for two different SKUs, I ordered two each of #93068 and #69590, hoping that may give me a blend of channels and possibly some pairs. I already own one of these units--not sure which channel it operates on--but that brings my Bunker Hill driveway alarm count total to five.



Ghost of Spookie said:


> Headed out in Black Friday traffic to my local HF for the alarms (a bit slow in spots but not that bad). The two I own from before were both # 93068 (both Channel 19). While they still list this as one of the product SKUs for the Black Friday sale price, none of the older boxes were left in my store. What my store had in stock was # 69590, and there were two different box styles for it. One appeared to be an older box with two white devices (bought the last 3 of those) and the other box was larger and thinner and came with a silver alarm device and a white sensor. Neither box design indicated a channel designation, nor did the instructions or devices themself. Don't have the time to open anything up now but if they can't be modified to set a different channel (jumper reconfig), I figure I have 2 of one channel and now 3 of probably another whatever channel that may be. Nice price.
> 
> What are you guys finding in your store?


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## Ghost of Spookie

Thanks for alerting us to the ability to order one SKU or the other online. It prompted me to call another driveable store location and they were able to search by the SKU and said that they have several dozens of the older SKU in stock. The clerk said she remembers people telling her those had separate channels. Interesting. Probably fellow HF members! Haha. Off to do lunch in that direction and stop in. 

The cashier yesterday said I could always return the newer SKU one if I found the ones I really wanted--pretty long return period. Not big on returning things especially for a few dollars but in this case it's a feature, not monetary. If I were keeping these for driveway/yard alert monitors I actually like the design of the older # 93068 model since the sensor has a dome-d top and any water would run off of it and not pool.


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## Ghost of Spookie

Channels 1, 2, 3, and 4 and some unmarked boxes of the # 93068 version at the San Jose store on Blossom Hill for anyone in the area looking to pick some up. On end cap and in separate aisle. Cool and that simplifies things.


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## mikeerdas

Ghost of Spookie said:


> Thanks for alerting us to the ability to order one SKU or the other online. It prompted me to call another driveable store location and they were able to search by the SKU and said that they have several dozens of the older SKU in stock. The clerk said she remembers people telling her those had separate channels. Interesting. Probably fellow HF members! Haha. Off to do lunch in that direction and stop in.
> 
> The cashier yesterday said I could always return the newer SKU one if I found the ones I really wanted--pretty long return period. Not big on returning things especially for a few dollars but in this case it's a feature, not monetary. If I were keeping these for driveway/yard alert monitors I actually like the design of the older # 93068 model since the sensor has a dome-d top and any water would run off of it and not pool.


You're very welcome Spookie. Thanks for your further research on models / SKUs. Will be helpful when / if I do returns of the units I ordered online.


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## mikeerdas

mikeerdas said:


> You're very welcome Spookie. Thanks for your further research on models / SKUs. Will be helpful when / if I do returns of the units I ordered online.


Did some browsing during lunch and my local HFT seems to have enough older model CH 1, 2, 3, 4 that I should be able to do some exchanges when my order arrives. They had a huge amount of the newer SKU and not so many of the older SKU. We'll see what happens. Not sure when my online units will arrive. Hope they don't give me a problem exchanging newer SKU models for older SKU models. The stickers on the back of the older SKU units, at least in my store, are clearly stickered with channel numbers, fortunately.

And the price is now back up to over $17 per unit.


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## namrog

I picked up one each over the weekend of the 69590 and the 61910, checked and they are different channels. They had one of the old ones left (ch 19) but it was really beat up and might have been an opened package so I passed on it. They also had the silver ones but I only needed two (for now!).


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## thenightmarefamily

Motion sensors are the best when you don't want the hasstle of having to time everything everytime someone walks by, just let the sensor do the work for you.


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## mikeerdas

The Harbor Freight Tools Bunker Hill driveway alarms are on sale again for $9.99 through Sunday 12/7:
http://www.harborfreight.com/


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## mikeerdas

*Picked up 3 of the older model Bunker Hill driveway alarms*

So, I went to HFT yesterday and purchased 3 of the older Bunker Hill driveway alarms: CH2, CH4, and CH19. And the one I actually have installed at my house is CH3. So that's 4 unique channels. The mail order ones still haven't arrived. Will see what I want to keep and/or return when they do.

Also got a heat gun for $8 (to help with electronics, and possibly for tightening up plastic wrap for a potential Pepper's Ghost concept).


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## BobbyA

You can change the channels in these pretty easily. About 10 pages ago I posted a short description about it.


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## mikeerdas

BobbyA said:


> You can change the channels in these pretty easily. About 10 pages ago I posted a short description about it.


Thanks Bobby. Knew there was a way to do it. Didn't know it was super simple--but think I remember it being just jumpers, no soldering. Jumpers would be pretty easy. I don't like soldering.


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## BobbyA

Yeah, the ones I've opened required a tiny amount of soldering to make new jumpers. I suppose it could be done with a conductive epoxy or conductive ink pen. But the bridges are really simple to solder.


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## Col. Fryght

I need to find my sensors. These simple buggers make my Halloween go.


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## Ghost of Spookie

Thought I would post a photo of two of the different channeled devices that I picked up on sale from them back in 11/2014. From the ad that they are currently running this model number is still available. Saves you from modifying anything if you want to control different props at different times when they are all in close enough proximity to each other to set off together otherwise.

Model 93068: (note the channel number specified on each box by CHx)


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## BobbyA

Some of the newer boxes have the channel number located in harder to find places, and channels go all the way into the 20's


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## Scary Papa

BobbyA, yeah I noticed on the newer boxes that I couldn't find a channel number list and I guess I just didn't know where to look.


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## BobbyA

On some boxes it's on the smaller sides. But don't be afraid to open the box, pull out the unit and look at the sticker on the plastic.
If they don't want people to open the boxes, then put the channel number on the outside.


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## mike2246

Just purchased 2 of these from local HF, no where on the box inside/out does it show a channel #, Looked at the device and only thing I see that could be it is just before item # 61910 it says 14b. Not sure if that's it or not.


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## Screaming Demons

mike2246 said:


> Just purchased 2 of these from local HF, no where on the box inside/out does it show a channel #, Looked at the device and only thing I see that could be it is just before item # 61910 it says 14b. Not sure if that's it or not.


There should be a white sticker on the front of the box. I think it says something like CH 14. Most of the channels are in the 15-19 range I believe.


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## mike2246

Screaming Demons said:


> There should be a white sticker on the front of the box. I think it says something like CH 14. Most of the channels are in the 15-19 range I believe.


Nope, Looked at all sides of the box on multiple units they had at HF and none at any stickers or indications of channel, so I just bought two hoping it was on the inside or on the item but nothing. I can take pics of the box if needed. 
Might check another HF just incase.


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## BobbyA

Mike, look at the units themselves. Some of the mfgs HF uses put the stickers on the units. Should Say something like CH12 or CH20 on a small sticker.


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## mike2246

Got it figured out, went back to HF and there are 3 item #'s that all look identical. Item # 61910 and 62447 do not have Ch# anywhere on box. Item # 93068 had Ch#'s on all boxes and I could find 3 different channels


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## mike2246

Just wanted to post my final product, I'm using 2 of the LED's and the Speaker with the wireless receiver. I used quick connects to easily connect disconnect for setup/take down or if I need to run a longer wire to a prop. then I sealed all the edges with liquid elec tape so no water gets in.


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## Whitewatervol

It looks like the newer ones no longer have channel numbers anywhere on the box. My local store had one old one that was marked channel 3. I bought 2 newer ones as well. Brought them home and both newer ones are the same channel.

Opened them up and I don't see any jumpers in the newer design. The newer version has a much different control board than the older one I bought. Not sure the channels are going to be configurable on the newer ones.

They do sell a motion activated battery powered light that I may try to hack instead of I can't find one of these with a 3rd channel.


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## BobbyA

Stay tuned, a friend asked me to look into the newer ones. He says they have changed how the leds are driven and won't trigger a specific model of prop controller like they used to. I'll also check on the channel selection method when I pick one up to take apart in the next week or so.


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## Whitewatervol

When I took apart the receiver on the one that did have a channel label, the LEDs are surface mounted with a plastic lens that covers them. Those would be hard to hack for a light activated prop.

The two without channel labels that are on the same channel have the normal LEDs with wire leads. Would be great to be able to modify channels on those since they seem to be the newer model.


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## BobbyA

I went to HF today looking for the 93068 model to answer a friend's questions. HF only had the 61910, I removed the battery covers (in store) but still could not find a channel number sticker on these. If you can send me a picture or two of the boards I'll see if I can locate something that would likely be the channel selector (if they still use them). As for the leds, if you can solder you should be able to remove a surface mount and place a couple small wires on the pads. Or if you have a multimeter find a place with a larger contact surface that connects to one side of the LED circuit, like power. Then you would only need to make one tiny (and 1 larger) connection to remote a leaded led to the other end of the wires to trigger your prop. If you want to send pictures use [email protected]


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## Whitewatervol

BobbyA said:


> I went to HF today looking for the 93068 model to answer a friend's questions. HF only had the 61910, I removed the battery covers (in store) but still could not find a channel number sticker on these. If you can send me a picture or two of the boards I'll see if I can locate something that would likely be the channel selector (if they still use them). As for the leds, if you can solder you should be able to remove a surface mount and place a couple small wires on the pads. Or if you have a multimeter find a place with a larger contact surface that connects to one side of the LED circuit, like power. Then you would only need to make one tiny (and 1 larger) connection to remote a leaded led to the other end of the wires to trigger your prop. If you want to send pictures use [email protected]


I sent some pictures of the internals of both units to your email. I appreciate any advice you have.


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## BobbyA

I'll copy our discussion here for others.
It looks like the 93068 alert you have is on channel 3, with A0 and A1 bridged, A2 & A3 open.

These can be simply added up, any unbridged or open equal 0 as in:

A0 being bridged = 1, A1 = 2, A2 = 4, A3 =8

So A0 & A1 = channel 3. A1 & A3 = channel 10 (2+8).

If you melt a large blob of solder on to and completely covering LED2 (assuming middle led also flashes when triggered) you should be able to wipe it off the board while the blob is liquid. Make sure the gap between it's contact pads is clean of bridging after. If you think you will have trouble soldering to the tiny pad nearest to the white writing LED2, you can scrape off the LED2 writing and the green coating under it to make a larger bare solder pad.

This is the contact point you want to use as the pir signal to your controller, or a remote LED.


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## Whitewatervol

I don't think my soldering skills are that finely tuned. I'll probably just use this one to trigger a sound activated prop. 

I'm likely going to return 1 of the other style ones I bought since it doesn't look like those will allow for easy channel modification. 

HF does sell a battery powered motion activated light that I may try to use instead. That won't give me all the flexibility of having a transmitter and receiver but may work on a couple of props where I want the trigger pretty close to the prop.

Wish I had bought these things 2-3 years ago when they were they sold ones with multiple channels and easier to solder LEDs.


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## BobbyA

Maybe you can find a couple older ones being sold on feebay as used. Like this one. You can probably search around and find others, maybe at a lower price. Check for "Open Box", new old stock, and finally used if you need more. https://www.ebay.com/itm/Bunker-Hil...a246:g:D4EAAOSw5BVdFztx&LH_ItemCondition=1500


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## Whitewatervol

I'm probably going to start by going to all the local HF stores to see what they have in stock. Might get lucky and they are currently on sale with coupon for $9.99.


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## Pebbles 610

Forgive me for this dumb question, but when you place the receiver by the sound activated prop how do you protect it from weather? Isn't the receiver designed to simply plug in an interior wall outlet?


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## Scary Papa

Pebbles 610 said:


> Forgive me for this dumb question, but when you place the receiver by the sound activated prop how do you protect it from weather? Isn't the receiver designed to simply plug in an interior wall outlet?


Not a dumb question at all. Both the sending unit and receiver are battery operated unless you elect to use the mini plug and a wall wart for power. You can cover the receiver with plastic wrap like Saran Wrap if you are concerned about moisture. Since our haunt is all outdoors if there is a high probability of rain we don't put the props that use the triggers out.


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## J-Man

Hey good to hear from you SP! I was beginning to wonder if you were still haunting! 🎃👍


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## BobbyA

Put it in an upside down ziplock freezer bag. Use a touch of sealant if needed where the wire passes through.


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## Scary Papa

J-Man said:


> Hey good to hear from you SP! I was beginning to wonder if you were still haunting! 🎃👍


Thanks J-Man. Actually we did not do our haunt last year. After so many years it just grew so big it got out of hand. And this year with COVID going on we are passing again. We are thinking about maybe doing something next year but we are getting older and it gets more difficult for us to put such a big thing together for just one night by ourselves. It literally takes us a week to put everything out in the haunted forest 10 acres, test the animatronics, and get all the projections ready. Then if rain is predicted we can't do anything until we know for sure what the weather is going to do because, as you know, water and electronics don't mix. Then it is really a big scramble to get the haunted forest ready. Then of course Wicked Grandma spends around $500 for food at the campground and we spend about the much making new props. And I never retire anything so it ALL get put back out every year, growing more and more every year. As much fun as it is and as much as we miss doing it sometimes I just have to remember I'm not 25 anymore and it is harder to do things than it used to be.


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## J-Man

Yeah, I get it. Maybe just do a scaled back version. If you have any covered areas available, maybe utilize those so rain won't be an issue. If you still enjoy doing this, then just do what you can, I'm sure your patrons will still be grateful! 🎃


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## Scary Papa

This thing just grew from a small haunt for family to include not only family but friends of family...friends of friends of family.... friends of friends of friends of family. Well, you get the idea. People did start to bring food to help with the big picnic before opening the haunted forest after dark. But still it started to become overwhelming. Like you mentioned J-Man, maybe something smaller next year.


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